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To: MD Expat in PA; dmz

“Is that constitutionally protected Free Speech”

Yes. Suggest you research the recent SCOTUS Westboro Baptist Church case and pay particular attention to this quote:

Chief Justice John Roberts:

“Speech is powerful. It can stir people to action, move them to tears of both joy and sorrow, and — as it did here — inflict great pain. On the facts before us, we cannot react to that pain by punishing the speaker.”

Likely this gets overturned on appeal.


62 posted on 06/02/2012 9:00:43 AM PDT by ScottfromNJ
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To: dmz; ScottfromNJ; from occupied ga; Norseman
“Speech is powerful. It can stir people to action, move them to tears of both joy and sorrow, and — as it did here — inflict great pain. On the facts before us, we cannot react to that pain by punishing the speaker.”

What Justice Roberts was talking about regarding WBC was their protected free speech to demonstrate at the funerals of US soldiers while expressing a religious belief (or some would also argue a political POV as well). While standing around with signs saying “Thank God for Dead Soldiers” is inflicting great emotional pain to the families and is vile and contemptible in my opinion, what the WBC wasn’t doing was saying, “Do Like God Does And Go Out And Kill A Soldier And Members Of Their Families, These People Over There In Particular”. The first is protected free speech, the second; well it may still be protected free speech but is questionable and borderline. In the first they are expressing an opinion; if they said the second, they’d be advocating commission of a violent crime.

See my post #61. Is there a difference if a NAMBLA member advocates child sex rape and instructs others on how to do it, but doesn’t actually commit child rape himself?

Or think of it this way, a Mafia Boss may be correct in saying “I never killed anybody in my life” but if after expressing the opinion that “Vinny the Bagman is scum and a snitch and should die”, he actually instructs members of his family to kill Vinny, he is not at that point merely exercising free speech even if he himself does not pull the trigger.

Also consider that as Norseman pointed out, this was not simple spanking. And from the article he posted: “…Caminiti knew it was illegal, because he had advised his flock not to punish their children this way in public places because it might be seen as abuse.” And “Also facing child abuse charges are Caminiti's son and daughter-in-law, Matt and Alina; his daughter and son-in-law Maria and Timothy Stephenson; and Timothy and Andrea Wick. Some of them testified under immunity agreements during Philip Caminiti's trial.”

If his own children and other members of his church testified that Caminiti told them to beat their children and told them to do so in private so as not avoid child abuse charges, I think this is probably what got prosecutors a conviction on conspiracy to commit child abuse and not of committing child abuse himself.

Likely this gets overturned on appeal.

You’re probably right and after giving it some additional thought, it perhaps should be. However what made me a bit angry were the not so much the folks who were defending his right to say that two month old infants should be beaten for crying, but those seemingly supporting that what he said was not only free speech under the guise of religion but that he was correct in saying so.

64 posted on 06/02/2012 11:38:36 AM PDT by MD Expat in PA
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