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To: Bobbys1963
But if Zimmerman is to have justifiably used self-defense, he can’t have provoked Martin’s attack.

Any lawyers out there who want to clarify that. What words would Zimmerman have had to utter to constitute a provocation?

What are you doing here? You don't belong here. I don't like your hoodie. I don't like Black people. The "N" word. I'm going to shoot you.

Are there any words that would justify a retaliation with a physical assault?

7 posted on 05/16/2012 2:16:39 PM PDT by TruthShallSetYouFree (Don't let Julia fool ya. Socialism doesn't work.)
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree

“Are there any words that would justify a retaliation with a physical assault?”

Yes. They are called “fighting words.” I don’t know if “nigger” alone would count, but “I’m going to shoot you” definitely would. Certainly in that situation.

The thing is, there’s no evidence of that on the 9-11 tape, nor did the neighbor who witnessed the fight hear it, nor Martin’s girlfriend, so far as I can tell. The fight started somehow, and it could have been Zimmerman’s fault. Not just fighting words, but sudden movements and brandishing his weapon would count. But the burden of proof is on the prosecution. They have to present evidence that Zimmerman instigated the violence, and so far all they have is that he followed Martin and “confronted” him, which could mean anything.

They have what they thinkis evidence of a depraved mindset in his obsession with stopping crime and in possibly profiling Martin. Such is necessary for 2nd degree murder, but not sufficient. You can kill someone in self-defense with a depraved mindset, when they threatened your life. A rabid racist can kill a black man who attacked him out of the blue, even if he also took great racist pleasure in it. You have to have started the fight to lose the right of self-defense. And to be convicted for having started it, the state needs evidence to prove you did.


20 posted on 05/16/2012 2:27:44 PM PDT by Tublecane
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To: TruthShallSetYouFree; Tublecane

IANAL, nor do I play one on TV, and I didn’t stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

BUT I am fairly certain that the concept of “fighting words” has gone by the wayside long ago, and that you simply aren’t justified in starting a physical altercation if someone used what might be considered same by some.


46 posted on 05/16/2012 3:00:49 PM PDT by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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