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To: dools0007world

Can anybody out there tell me what the financial woes are?


Profit - And that’s not a dirty word.

If a refiner (or any business) can not obtain a profit from the facility it operates, it must consider the alternative.

Ask the stock holders of these companies what they think.
(Look in your 401K or mutual fund first)


14 posted on 01/09/2012 8:03:40 AM PST by maine yankee (I got my Governor at 'Marden's')
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To: maine yankee

Profit, as a component in a supply and demand economy, is not an issue with me. I do have a problem being raped by any collusive industry whose members produce annual reports—supposedly public documents) that are deliberately misleading.

For instance, I Googled a simple question: What is Exxon-Mobile Petroleum Refining income? I could not find an answer anywhere no matter how many ways I asked the question. Don’t pretend to be anything but a novice at reading annual reports or dealing with financial info. If that number was in the company’s annual report I could not find it.

I was able to find a summary of branded refinery cost for Dec 2011 to Jan 2012. 23 and 31 cents on the dollar, respectively. I presume costs encompass all categories of doing business—including gov’t. environmental and safety requirements. In the absense of any other info and by extension, it appears to me like the industry increased its petroleum refinery profitability over the course of that year. Realizing a net profit of better 60 cents/$ seems like a damn good business to me. To the industry’s credit it did this with existing capacity.

My problem with the oil industry and the government is they lie through their teeth. I remember interviewing a Houston-based oil company back in the 70s—about the time of the Carter debacle. One of the people in the room tried to make the argument gas should cost 5$/gal because a gal. of gas could move a 5,000 lb. car 15 miles or some such. Had nothing to do with the quaint concept of “reasonable profit”, supply/demand or any other rational barometer.

It became clear to me at the time (I interviewed most of the major oil companies) that these companies were no more American than Bic pen or Mercedes Benz. And they lie and/or mislead.

As for collusion, the evidence is at the pump. There is simply no credible way three or four different companies, headquartered, producing and shipping from around the country (let alone the globe) can consistently post the exact same price on any given day.

You seem to be a smart fella. Is there a place I can go that breaks down the refinery dollar by relevant costs and profit? I spent an hour looking and was not successful finding it.

I’m not trying to be a wiseguy. I would love to be repudiated. But it’s obvious I’ve arrived at a point where I should be better educated than I am about how the oil industry works and accounts for itself. Empirical evidence only goes so far.

Thank you in advance for a constructive reply.


25 posted on 01/09/2012 10:21:36 AM PST by dools0007world
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