Posted on 11/18/2011 4:16:38 PM PST by wagglebee
When one considers the ethics of manipulation, the question of whether we ought to, or whether we may manipulate an organism or entity depends on the answer to the first and most fundamental question:
In the fields of obstetrical medicine and reproductive medicine the ethical debates have raged for four decades. Enlightened discourse between opposing parties must assume good motives by all involved, and then go about asking the essential questions, following where the truth of science and reason lead.
Many claim that life begins at some point distant from fertilization, always beyond the point at which they propose some manipulation (abortion, embryonic stem cell culturing, etc…). There are always a list of biological functions that are given to define when human life begins: Cognitive capacity, etc.
The simple biological truth of the matter is that the Cell Theory states that all cells arise from pre-existing cells. There is no blackout period between sperm and egg uniting, and then the emergence of ‘life’ at some point distant.
The Carnegie stages of human development indicate that human development begins in the zygotic stage. Then there is the assertion of developmental biologist and leading textbook author in the field, Scott Gilbert. In his text, Gilbert takes us through the life cycle of a dog. His text, Developmental Biology, is arguably the leading text in the field. According to Gilbert:
“Traditional ways of classifying catalog animals according to their adult structure. But, as J. T. Bonner (1965) pointed out, this is a very artificial method, because what we consider an individual is usually just a brief slice of its life cycle. When we consider a dog, for instance, we usually picture an adult. But the dog is a “dog” from the moment of fertilization of a dog egg by a dog sperm. It remains a dog even as a senescent dying hound. Therefore, the dog is actually the entire life cycle of the animal, from fertilization through death.”
First, note how he sets the word dog off in quotes at one point, to communicate the very essence of the organism:
But the dog is a “dog” from the fertilization of a dog egg by a dog sperm…
The same may be said of all vertebrates, including cats, giraffes, chimpanzees, and humans. Substituting the word human for dog in Gilbert’s analysis gets to the heart of the matter. We are human for our entire life cycle. We are whole and complete in form and function at every stage of our development, for that given developmental stage. The prepubescent child is fully human, even though they lack the capacity to execute all human functions, such as abstract reasoning, or reproduction.
In the same way, the early embryo is alive and fully human, though it has not yet executed all human organismal functions.
Photo via: embryology.med.unsw.edu.au
“...the kind of argument...”
Are our laws the sole definition of what’s good for us and what’s bad for us? If our government doesn’t make abortion illegal then is abortion an ok thing to do?
How big do you want our government to be? Are individuals or groups of individuals that aren’t governments incapable of coming to reasonable conclusions? If one individual reaches a certain conclusion about somthing and another individual reaches a different conclusion, is one of them wrong?
Maybe for you it’s real simple: you just think you’re correct on the abortion issue and everyone that disagrees with you is both wrong and offensive.
Murder is wrong. Period. End of story.
If you don’t like that, take up the argument with God.
The government has no business legalizing murder and it is not a matter of big, over-reaching government for abortion to be illegal.
The same for the 60 day mark of development. A point when most women find out for sure and the baby is clearly human.
Psalm 139:13-16 13For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother’s womb. 14I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well.
15 My frame was not hidden from you,when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth.
16Your eyes saw my unformed substance;in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them.
It’s not above mine.
zot
How big do you want our government to be? Are individuals or groups of individuals that aren’t governments incapable of coming to reasonable conclusions? If one individual reaches a certain conclusion about somthing and another individual reaches a different conclusion, is one of them wrong?
Hey troll, the PURPOSE of government is to protect individual rights, so it damn well better be big enough to protect the life of the unborn.
Maybe for you it’s real simple: you just think you’re correct on the abortion issue and everyone that disagrees with you is both wrong and offensive.
Yes troll, EVERYONE who is pro-abortion is both wrong and offensive.
Hey, simpleton, it was “big government” overruling state law that made abortion “legal.” Only, it wasn’t done legally through congressional legislation. It was done by the progressive big government liberal activist judiciary overruling God, the Declaration, the Constitution, the states and the will of the people.
In case you haven’t noticed, FR is proactively pro-life. Those who oppose us are the enemy within. Congratulations, you are now among the enemy without.
Bye.
Thank you!
I realize you’re gone (YAY!) but what about murder? Are you also not qualified to tell others what their conclusions should be?
Should murder be medically safe? Should our government not make it totally illegal and should not subsidize it?
Well said!
FRPosty, if that in utero baby weren't living, then they wouldn't have to kill it. Think about it.
Life is protected by our constitution. No one can be deprived of life or liberty without due process of law.
5th Amendment: "No person ... shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law"[Constitution for the United States of America][1]
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
I would have you note that the Preamble of the Constitution, its purpose statement, says that this Constitution applies "to our Posterity." In other words, to those NOT YET born.
Therefore, no unborn can be deprived of life without due process of law.
So far as I know, the unborn have committed no capital offense.
Actually, though, the right to life is not a matter of having been written in our document named the constitution. It is a right given by God. Those who deprive others of life will answer to God.
The real question for you, though, FRposty, is whether the unborn are "life". Once you answer that question, then the rest is really a matter of God and the law.
Do you have a pinglist for zots?
No, but 50mm and darkwing104 and Old Sarge do.
For those that argue “choice”, I try to point out they had the choice to keep their knees together.
This is as close to the classical definition of moral relativism as it gets. It is this type of thinking that is the result of a culture that wants God out of their lives. I call it the Culture of Death because what God wants is life and the result of moral relativism is death. The death of millions of babies through abortion is case closed on the matter.
There is something about the word smite that comes to mind. You are God’s servant. Spot on!
Abortions are never medically safe because the baby is always killed. Push your Romneyisms elsewhere. ZOT!
To be added or removed form the Viking Kitty/ZOT Ping List, FReepmail Darkwing104 or 50mm.
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