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To: org.whodat

Whodat makes some very valid points!

The cost of a double walled pipeline to the gulf coast is enormous.

The cost of permits to refine heavy oil in the upper states, then actually build refineries and the ancillary power plants, is also enormous.

Then, the added cost of piping numerous grades of volatile refined product from the upper states to the US/Canadian markets is also enormous, needing more permits than the pumping of raw crude.

Yet an upper states infrastructure of refineries, able to process a full pipeline of product, actually makes it difficult to sell the refined product on the world markets, as it’s so distant from ports, keeping it for North American consumption. And, the Canadians would more directly benefit from product originating within its borders, piped back to Canada.

Whodat may have just saved the snaildarter from extinction, but on economics, his thoughts have lots of merit for further study.


53 posted on 10/07/2011 8:38:29 PM PDT by Noob1999 (Loose Lips, Sink Ships)
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To: Noob1999
The cost of a double walled pipeline to the gulf coast is enormous.

We do not have a double walled pipeline in the US and there is not one plan anywhere. I have been on the design team of several pipeline new builds and expansions.

We add pipeline sleeves for locations like road crossing where it is required but never a whole pipeline.

Keep in mind while refineries mainly produce gasoline and diesel, they also produce a lot of other byproducts as well. That is why most of the industries chemical plants are near by the refinery centers.

Also, refineries take in more than just crude oil. In a modern refinery, units like hydrotreaters and hydrocrackers. In areas like Houston, it may be more economical for refineries to tie into the existing hydrogen pipeline and buy it, rather than build their own hydrogen production unit.

Refineries also produce produce products like residuum, petroleum coke, sulfur. These have to reach their markets as well and that isn't in North Dakota. While we have refinery capacity, but are using it to refine oil from OPEC nations, it makes far more economic sense to add a single pipeline to reach more of the refineries, than build entirely new refinery and have to transport multiple products through different pipelines while also adding more expensive rail traffic to move the products that will not flow through pipelines.

55 posted on 10/08/2011 5:40:00 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Noob1999
Whodat makes some very valid points!

I wish you could show me just one of those.

58 posted on 10/08/2011 11:39:37 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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