Posted on 08/28/2011 9:48:20 AM PDT by kristinn
With Citizenship, comes allegiance owed.
Barry, by birthright, was born owing allegiance to the British crown.
Nice find!
True. However, a child can give up their own citizenship.
F. RENUNCIATION FOR MINOR CHILDRENParents cannot renounce U.S. citizenship on behalf of their minor children. Before an oath of renunciation will be administered under Section 349(a)(5) of the INA, a person under the age of eighteen must convince a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer that he/she fully understands the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation, is not subject to duress or undue influence, and is voluntarily seeking to renounce his/her U.S. citizenship.
Question is...did Barry?
It sure does. It's just not "encouraged" because of the potential problems that arrise from it.
7 FAM 081: U.S. Policy on Dual Nationality:http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86563.pdf(e)While recognizing the existence of dual nationality, the U.S. Government does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Dual nationality may hamper efforts by the U.S. Government to provide diplomatic and consular protection to individuals overseas. When a U.S. citizen is in the other country of their dual nationality, that country has a predominant claim on the person.
...
the U.S. Supreme Court has stated that dual nationality is a "status long recognized in the law" and that "a person may have and exercise rights of nationality in two countries and be subject to the responsibilities of both." See Kawakita v. United States, 343 U.S. 717 (1952).
And this...
US State Department Services Dual Nationalityhttp://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html... The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad. The country where a dual national is located generally has a stronger claim to that person's allegiance.
However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there...
It should be self evident from merely a cursory reading of the history of the time that the intent for the requirement, and the term itself "natural born Citizen" is incompatible with being a multi-national who owes allegiance to multiple countries.
That's right. Barry was born owing allegiance to the crown of her majesty the Queen of England, inherited by birthright from his foreign father.
The thought that he is a "natural born Citizen" is absurd.
Maybe, this argument has yet to be conclusively proven at all.
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A minor child most definitely can renounce their own U.S. citizenship.
See #122.
Of course, the question remains....did Barry?
A military draft comes in to play as well.
Those who argue that the United States has no obligation to recognize and respect dual nationality – as to American citizens – have been unequivocally proved wrong by official correspondence between former Secretary of State Robert Lansing (who served from 1905-1920) and former Senator Henry Cabot Lodge.The opinion of the State department was published in The American Journal of International Law, Volume 9. We shall begin with the factual background to this official inquiry:
“MY DEAR SENATOR LODGE: I have received your letter of June 5, 1915, in reply to my letter of June 2, concerning the detention in Italy for military service of Ugo Da Prato, who was born in Boston, August 25, 1895, and went to Italy in 1912 to study architecture, and whose father, Antonio Da Prato, a native of Italy, obtained naturalization, as a citizen of this country in the District Court of the United States at Boston, March 19, 1892; that is, before the son’s birth…Please take notice of two crucial facts. First, the State Department was particularly concerned that the father had naturalized before the son was born. Second, the State Department also took official notice of the nationality laws of Italy as a determining factor. Such recognition is necessary for many reasons, the least of which is the avoidance of diplomatic conflicts.As Ugo Da Prato was born in this country after his father had obtained naturalization as a citizen of the United States, it does not appear that he can be considered an Italian subject under Italian law, and I have no doubt he will be released.”
...
As Secretary Lansing’s letter clearly indicates, had the son been born before his father naturalized [edit: the son would have been born a U.S. citizen...BUT], Italy could require him to serve in the military (and bear arms against the US). And there would have been nothing the US could do about it. This is a perfect example of why the US Commander In Chief should never have possessed dual allegiance. Such a state of affairs is completely unnatural to allegiance and to the oath of office.
Meandering thru Professor Gilmore’s Lectures on Vattel..he notes..where Vattel is in the Constitution..this includes the Bill of Rights.
Amazing stuff. Not bad for an “obscure” “French” philosopher...
Howie Carr just reported that the illegal alien has a legal SS# and a legal driver’s license. (MA makes it easy for these ‘folks’.) Turns out the same lawyer who got Auntie Zeituni legal status is representing Uncle Omar. Also, Omar’s legal SS# is more than twenty years old, again according to the MA DMV. [My guess is Dukakis gave it to him. Dukakis used to give them out like Halloween candy.]
So you really think a US consular officer would believe a child 10 years old or younger is capable of "fully understanding the nature and consequences of the oath of renunciation?"
The very notion is ludicrous. This portion of the law is generally, probably exclusively, applied only in the case of older teens.
There is also the very obvious fact that nobody has provided any evidence whatsoever that any such renunciation ever took place.
I’m sure she is. But her status as a Philipine national has no bearing on her status as an American citizen.
Possibly I worded my response poorly. It’s not that the US does not recognize that dual citizens exist, it is that the existence of citizenship in another country has not effect on the American’s rights or obligations as an American citizen.
Native-born citizen means that one has citizenship from birth.
I have seen evidence that satisfies me he was born in the USA (jus solis) to an American citizen mother (jus sanguinis) and a father legally in the country as a student.
You are welcome to believe otherwise if you so choose.
Thanks...listening..wondering if the ssn was obtained in Conn.
They can’t be president though.
I posted on the wrong thread, it appears. There’s another one devoted exclusively to the subject:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2770498/posts
There is no proof he was born in the US.
There is actually no proof that 0bama the Kenyan and Stanley Ann Dunham are his parents, either.
“Army veteran says he was ‘singled out’ after objecting to email suggesting President Obama isn’t U.S. citizen”....
Huntsville, Alabama
http://blog.al.com/breaking/2011/08/army_veteran_says_he_was_singl.html
Wow! I read the whole article.
It’s very discouraging when a patriotic and intelligent person is absolutely blinded due to racism. And that’s his problem. Very sad.
That is factually wrong.
Regardless whether the "notion" seems "ludicrous" to you or not is entirely irrelevant to the facts at hand.
And the fact is, it is entirely possible for Barry...as a minor, to renounce his U.S. citizenship.
Nobody reading this, including you, know whether he did or did not.
Just one of many critical unanswered questions surrounding the guy with his hands on our nuclear football.
B.T.W. I believe it's "ludicrous" that a marxist with foreign citizenship ties is currently "acting" as Commander in Chief or our armed forces...but that's just "me."
"There is also the very obvious fact that nobody has provided any evidence whatsoever that any such renunciation ever took place."
LOL. Your joking....right? Simply add this to the long list of documents the guy has sequestered.
I have seen evidence that satisfies me he was born in the USA (jus solis) to an American citizen mother (jus sanguinis) and a father legally in the country as a student."
Babies born to illegal aliens are currently considered "native" born...by a serious bastardization of the intent of the 14th. Even though they have zero attachment to the country.
What evidence have you seen that has you believing he was born in Hawaii?
When people say the evidence shows that Zero had an American mother and was born in HI I always wonder where they saw the evidence and what it was. Because no one else has seen any.
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