Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Tublecane

Germany was responsible?

Russia was responsible for the 1st world war. They were the first power to throw their weight around. Had the alliance between Russia and Germany stayed around, the world would not have gone to war.


20 posted on 02/04/2011 9:28:44 AM PST by BenKenobi (one of the worst mistakes anybody can make is to bet against Americans.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies ]


To: BenKenobi

“Russia was responsible for the 1st world war. They were the first power to throw their weight around.”

You, sir, have been duped by Germany. Just so happens that, according to diplomatic conventions, throwing your weight around and mobilizing for war are not themselves acts of war. They never had been considered such, except suddenly by Germany in 1914. I wonder why?

Germany deliberately built their system around being able to mobilize in the midst of fighting, whereas Russia and France had to mobolize first, for weeks, before they had stategic options. This allowed Germany to wait until after its enemies mobilized to invade them, thus plausibly blaming them for starting it. Well, plausibly to people who nowadays don’t realize mobilizing for war and fighting a war aren’t the same thing. But they didn’t fool everyone way back when.

By the way, if Russia started it, why did Germany invade Belgium? What does Belgium have to do with Russia? What does Germany and Russia not being allies anymore have anything to do with Germany trying to conquer France?


22 posted on 02/04/2011 9:39:06 AM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies ]

To: BenKenobi

“What does Germany and Russia not being allies anymore have anything to do with Germany trying to conquer France?”

By the way, I realize the answer is that Russia starting it by throwing its weight around and thus causing war with Germany would have left Germany vulnerable to a backstabbing by France, which justified them in a preventive attack. Not only do you now justify Germany in treating a country throwing its weight around as a cause for war, which was never the case before. But they are also justified in invading another country because they might at some point in the future attack them while they’re fighting the aforementioned war. Which, also, was never the case before.

Reminds me of those who argue that the Soviets were justified in conquering Eastern Europe because they had been invaded a couple of times in the recent past. Which, first of all, ignores the imperialistic wars they fought shortly before being invaded against Poland and Finland. But it also acts as if everyone else is just a pawn in the nation in question’s strategic calculations. As if they have no dignity of their own.

Never have I heard such thin justifications for empire. At least in the dark old days of colonialism they argued that their rule was better for those they had conquered.


25 posted on 02/04/2011 9:46:49 AM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies ]

To: BenKenobi

By the way, it’s a fact well established in historical scholarship that Germany started the war. It hasn’t been controversial since the publication in the 60s of the research into German archives of Fritz Fischer and others. No one much argues with it anymore, except to make vague arguments about militarism, nationalism, imperialism interlocking alliances, and arms races. And even these amount to not much more than historical/cultural determinism. “Germany did it, but its not Germany’s fault because it was born in poverty, its mom abused it, and its dad was systematically discriminated against.”

Not that scholars are always right, even in unanimity. But in this case, they are. I suggest you check out: “Europe’s Last Summer” by David Fromkin. Or, one of my favorites, “Closing Pandora’s Box” by Patrick Glynn.


55 posted on 02/04/2011 12:30:01 PM PST by Tublecane
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson