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To: Blueflag; Cincinatus' Wife
"Methane is essentially INSOLUBLE in salt water. Methane GAS, originating from the busted well head or from sublimating methane hydrate(s) would NOT persist in the marine environment under ANY circumstances. The methane CH4 would either escape into the atmosphere or reform as crystalline methane hydrate."

Sorry, not correct. "Essemtially insoluble" is NOT the same as "completely insoluble". "Some" methane WILL dissolve:

www.geochem-model.org/publications/43-GCA_2006_3369.pdf

Yeah, a some of it made it to the surface and escaped, and some was trapped on the sea floor as hydrate, but a signficant fraction also dissolved as the hydrocarbon colum was rising through the FIVE MILES of depth in those regions where the temps are too high for hydrate formation.

30 posted on 01/07/2011 6:54:08 AM PST by Wonder Warthog
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To: Wonder Warthog

Not flaming you, but ... a scientifically weak response from you. Here’s why:

I did not, specifically and deliberately, write that methane IS insoluble. Only YOU used the word “completely”. No real scientist disputes facts— but DOES dispute hypotheses, methods, conclusions and conjecture; and factually CH4 does (barely) dissolve in sea water. But let’s stick to what that really means, especially compared to other gases that dissociate in water, and also those that have a biological impact.

Secondly, CH4 gas solubility *IS* well documented and in comparison to other biologically active gases like CO2 or H2S is and was (temporarily) present in the cold salt water as a solute at metabolically insignificant levels. ie it had NO effect on the biome.

Thirdly, CH4 gas is (AIR) NON-TOXIC to aerobic marine life, except in suffocating quantities.

Fourth - A release of CH4 gas into the cold depths of the Gulf would NATURALLY cause an ostensibly detectable increase in dissolved methane, which, absent ANY biological activity, WOULD obey the laws of physics and known gas laws and NATURALLY return to a steady state based on solubility, temperature pressure and salinity/ionization.

Fifth - To claim that the thousands of tons of released gaseous methane would dissolve into the sea water in quantities sufficient to support a bloom in (some heretofore unknown) bacteria that thrive on CH4 is absurd. Did you look at the fractions in the release? By volume and mass, the CH4 fraction was huge, even in comparison to the volume of crude released. We even had a discussion about this on FR. I can’t find that thread of course. Were this a spill of organic iron or phosphate compounds, we’d have a real bloom/death on our hands. (nee the Gulf dead zone)

Fifth - marine biologists are well aware of (naturally occurring) bacteria that are happy to ‘gobble up’ hydrocarbons - ESPECIALLY dissolved or colloidal/emulsified liquid (higher molecular weight) hydrocarbons. I’ve since forgotten the genus/species. The lower molecular weight hydrocarbons and the aromatics DO tend to dissipate faster (either by evaporation, dissolution or biological consumption) while the heavier ones DO tend to form the more persistent tar balls we see. They take longer to metabolize and dissipate.

Sixth: “scientists” used to believe the sun revolved around the earth and burned heretics who reported the contrary. I am confident about what I have written. But. *IF* a good bit of research showed me I am wrong, and my ‘knowledge’ is shown to be a ‘belief’ ... I will (un)happily eat crow and become an ardent and strident convert to methane gas disaster believer.

Net: bacteria naturally metabolize oil spills, and this is NOT news. Also to report that bacteria are the reason methane GAS from a benthic release has gone away is scientifically and biologically absurd.

I sincerely enjoy the debate. Please do not infer any personal animus or attack.

FRegards,

Blueflag


33 posted on 01/07/2011 7:30:10 AM PST by Blueflag (Res ipsa loquitur)
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