Posted on 12/07/2010 12:20:30 PM PST by Winged Hussar
Israel and the United States need to learn how they do things in Russia, because the way they do things in Russia usually works.
Somalia pirates' clash with Russian navy reveals a gap in rule of law
(Excerpt) Read more at israpundit.com ...
You might be right. I don't know the maritime law. But the article implied there was a legal or judicial process that the captain didn't want to get caught up in. So he ignored it.
If international law currently allows captured pirates to be executed by ship captains without trial, which I doubt, then so be it. But then I would suggest that a firing squad would be more appropriate, as it's more certain and less torturous than what this Russian Captain did.
But since a Russian captain and crew did it, the pirates are likely to avoid Russian ships in future.
Piracy on the high seas cannot always be dealt with using the niceties of due process. The Somalis are brigands and understand only the use of deadly force.
And there is also a Somali underworld problem in this country, just saying.
I am in complete agreement with you. My point was that those who try to neuter us with political correctness don’t bother with it themselves.
Your comment and your tag line are in agreement and I agree with both. It is the age old battle between good and evil with evil having the easier path.
International law used to allow for the hanging of pirates. In our so-called “enlightened” age, this is no longer the case. The biggest screw-up by the Russian was to talk about what happened. If pirate crews simply disappeared, piracy would become a less attractive form of employment.
My best picture has the pirate crew all hanging over the side, very dead, as their craft slowly enters homeport on autopilot. Now THAT sends a message.
All the stupid ones were eaten by wolves, or died drinking booze made from shoe polish and antifreeze.
Here, we elevate them, give them degrees, and elect them to run the country. There is no winnowing process.
Scum Floats.
If the law now is ineffective, then we need to fix it.
It worries me when there are so many on FR that are willing to chunk the rule of law and adopt vigilante justice when they don't like the results.
We seem to opt for anarchy rather than the fixing of laws and processes, and that is not a long-term strategy that supports democracy.
But since a Russian captain and crew did it, the pirates are likely to avoid Russian ships in future.
Who will tell them it was the Russians? Seems to me the onshore priates will remain in the dark as much as ever about the forces they are challenging.
Exactly! Go back and look up what the Soviets did with the jihadis they caught kidnapping Russian diplomats back in Beirut in the ‘80s. The jihadis left the Russians alone after that...
Russia Applies Rule 303 to Terrorists (Pirates)... 350 miles off the coast of Yemen
Misprint — it should have been “Russia Applies Rule 350 to Terrorists (Pirates) :)
IMHO, the judicial process ain’t fixable. There are simply too many conflicting agendas involved. However, shooting pirates on sight, and hanging the survivors from the yardarm is both pragmatic and a time-honored tradition.
When the judicial process is fixed, then you might have a valid complaint against the Russians. In the mean time, I wish all the anti-pirate patrol ships would emulate them.
Like you and so many of us, “vigilante justice” is unappealing. That said, it is preferable to “perverted justice” the era of which we are entering. I would recommend that you begin preparing yourself to lead your community in not only defending itself but “taking care of social infractions that had been derailed” as well.
Personally, when the SHTF I don’t think I would have any problem with telling someone who survived an encounter with our community, Bible in one hand and hemp rope in the other, “May God forgive you...” Anyone who would try to harm us or take our means of subsistence by force can expect all the mercy they were prepared to show us.
In a day and age where the courts will give 14 year old “kid” is going to get 3 years in prison for 4 beheadings, vigilante justice begins to look very appealing.
The sooner society realizes and understands that there are lots of folks who NEED killing, the better off we’ll be.
I would not call it vigilante justice.
Offshore, sometimes hundreds of miles, the time honored laws of the Seas apply. The Captain of the attacked ship is the Law. Or the Captain of the ship that rescues him.
You repel the pirates, you can do with them what you wish, since they probably would’ve killed you anyway.
Yes, they’re taking hostages in Somalia, but that’s no reason to allow them to interfere with shipping, trade, commerce and to pose a hazard and threat to sailors lives.
Political correctness hasn’t come to russia yet. They still know how to take out the trash.
Ping me when it’s time to start crying.
I don't accept that.
Even if it was true that there is no judicial process that would work, that wouldn't be perverted over time, we still control the law through elected officials. (Ok maybe not in the case of international law but even then as a sovereign nation we either agree to abide by the international law or we don't.)
As long as the election process is not corrupt, we should endeavor to either perfect the judicial process or make the law reflect the enforcement reality.
In other words, if the law needs to read captured pirates are executable by maritime captains, because no judicial or trial process will work for them. Then that's what the law needs to say.
I can't applaud a Russian captain killing captured pirates, even though they almost certainly deserved it, when it means ignoring the rule of law. That undermines the rule of all law.
If that's what the law currently says, fine. But the article implied it wasn't, that the Russian captain sought to avoid the established legal process, so set them free in a way that amounted to a self appointed execution.
In former years, “International Maritime Law” was whatever Parliament and the Royal Navy said it was. Nowadays, it is whatever the do-nothing-useful dictators that populate the UN and the do-nothing-useful sluggards of the World Court say it is.
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