Posted on 10/30/2010 4:03:35 PM PDT by Rashputin
Stunning Michael Geer
The Vatican has called for Israel to end its occupation of "Arab lands," noting that all of what we define currently as Israel is "Arab land."
That the Bible must not be used to justify either their ‘occupation' nor their ‘injustices' against Palestinians.
"The Holy Scriptures cannot be used to justify the return of Jews to Israel and the displacement of the Palestinians, to justify the occupation by Israel of Palestinian lands," Monsignor Cyril Salim Bustros, Greek Melkite archbishop of Our Lady of the Annunciation in Boston, Massachusetts, and president of the "Commission for the Message," said at Saturday's Vatican press conference.
"We Christians cannot speak of the ‘promised land' as an exclusive right for a privileged Jewish people. This promise was nullified by Christ. There is no longer a chosen people - all men and women of all countries have become the chosen people."
You've just been witness to a significant event in the End Times unfolding, amigo. The Vatican stating that Israel is "no longer a chosen people".
The Vatican has just nullified the Bible, and elevated Replacement Theology in full public view.
This is .... stunning.
You- Most people are innately good.
God-”All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.”
Zechariah 14:2
For I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem 3 to wage war; the city will be taken, its houses plundered, and the women raped. Then half of the city will go into exile, but the remainder of the people will not be taken away.
http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Zec&chapter=14&verse=2
Grammatically speaking, for the continuous present to be accurate, Jerusalem would currently be besieged, its houses currently plundered, and their women currently raped, and the armies would currently be in the process of exiling half of the city.
Thus, it is not accurate to say “we are witnessing the fulfillment of Zechariah 14:2”, because Zechariah 14:2 gives multiple details, all of which must be fulfilled before the verse itself may be considered to be fulfilled.
Of course, Zechariah 14:2 must also be fulfilled in line with the rest of Zechariah 14. Thus, we will know that Zechariah 14:2 has been fulfilled when 14:1-21 have been fulfilled, and not before.
You don’t remember what happened, do you?
Yes
I’ll remember yesterday.
I should probably be more specific.
Not only do I not see a point in history where Israel fully possessed what was promised, there is a second issue...
Genesis 13:15, “for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever.”
...How do you fulfill “forever” before time ends?
Genesis 15:18, God formalizes this covenant unconditionally and specifies the land, which Israel has never possessed in its entirety - so far. “To your descendants I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates- the land of the Kenites, Kenizzites, Kadmonites, Hittites, Perizzites, Rephaites, Amorites, Canaanites, Girgashites and Jebusites.””
Not trying to convince anyone else, but that’s why I wrote what I did.
Maybe. Judy messed it up — she’s the one who forgot the cameras would be rolling that day. How could you forget Judy?
We got married YEARS ago! And you, you were the best man. How could you forget that?
I was supposed to be the best man. I guess YOU forgot what happened at the Bachelor Party.
I was drunk. You however, couldn’t keep you eye off of... Well, I’ll never say.
Is this despicable crap a f**king JOKE? If so, all I want to know is what will be the name of the mosque that will be built upon the ruins of the Vatican. And good riddance to them.
That would be Penelope and Daphne, the twins. Well not quite twins, “Irish twins” born ten months apart.
They are grown, have children of their own. In fact Daphne had triplets, one of each!
We are discussing the archbishop's claim that the Church teaches modern Jews have no special God-given right to the land of Israel. Are you saying there is a difference between the Eastern and Roman Rite Catholic teaching on this issue?
Come to an Assembly of God church sometime. Firmly fixed on Scripture, the Holy Spirit, and Missions. We’re a little wild for some. But we love the Lord and we love our fellow Christians. It’s also the only church I’ve attended where the congregations don’t split up into white, hispanic, and black.
I’ll argue doctrine when appropriate. But I believe that if you confess the risen Christ as your savior with your heart and your tongue, I have far more in common with you (regardless of doctrinal errors either or both of us have made) than I do with a new-ager or a secular humanist who lives next door to me and votes conservative. Fortunately, God doesn’t require us to get all our doctrine right—or we would all go to Hell.
Mordechay Lewy, Israel’s ambassador to the Holy See, told The Jerusalem Post that Bustros, in saying that Jesus nullified God’s covenant with the Jewish people, was “returning to successionist theology, contradicting Second Vatican Council teaching and Pope Benedict himself – who has welcomed the return of Jews to their ancient homeland.”
Bustros isn’t Catholic.
What was promised?
Genesis 15:18, God formalizes this covenant unconditionally and specifies the land, which Israel has never possessed in its entirety - so far. “To your descendants I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the Euphrates- the land of the Kenites, Kenizzites, Kadmonites, Hittites, Perizzites, Rephaites, Amorites, Canaanites, Girgashites and Jebusites.””
Yes. Supersessionism (or “replacement”) theology has never been embraced by the Catholic Magisterium. Individual theologians may have taught it, Augustine roundly opposed it. In Catholic theology the Church fulfills but does not replace, Israel as God’s people.
Politically, the Holy See has always been cautious about the uncritical enthusiasm for the state of Israel that accompanies some kinds of Protestant eschatology. Catholic eschatology looks for God’s chosen people to play some kind of role in the eschaton but does not see the founding of the State of Israel as a key to the End Times. For Catholics and for the Holy See, the secular state of Israel is one among all the other nation-states and is dealt with along the same lines.
Many Christians in the Middle East do not like Israel. Maybe they are justified in this, maybe they are not. But just because they don’t take the same line toward the state of Israel as blank-check American Eangelicals do, doesn’t mean they hate Jews.
The synod apparently has taken a harder anti-state-of-Israel line than Vatican diplomacy does. If the synod actually claimed that supersessionism is true, then they are at odds theologically with the Church. But I’d reserve final judgment pending more careful study of what the synod actually said.
It is possible for a national or regional group of bishops to do stupid things. The American bishops do so routinely. But whether this synod of Middle Eastern bishops has done that, I don’t know.
What I do know is that to say that this is the voice of “the Vatican” is ignorant.
But then it wouldn’t be the first time that those who already hate the Catholic Church have seized on specious evidence to make drastic, false claims.
And it won’t be the last.
Israel was both a container and an allegory, a small and earthly rendition in time and space of something much more wonderful and profound.
I think you are seeing the hand, but not the shadow, which more fully captures the profundity of those promises. In missing this, I think you may be missing something of the greatness and transcendence of the Most High, His wonders, His wisdom.
This is just my humble opinion.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.