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To: Immerito
sorry, *defensive* use of arms is not 'living by the sword'...no mention of 'rebuke' in the gospel of Luke [merely informs that the cross must happen], but again the *context* of Matthew is clear in verse 26:53-54...Lord Jesus could summon an army of angels and wouldnt 'miss'...its about the timing and the motives for use of power, be it human steel or divine supernatural power...

again, the command was to arm themselves, for defense, ie two swords 'is enough'...Peters lack of proficiency notwithstanding, if he wasnt meant to use it, why did he have it in the garden, where they were all simpy going to pray ??? Peters was on the verge of going 'offensive' against overwhelming numbers and getting killed w/o fulfilling his future dscipleship...the Lord showed him the difference between Gods Will and human will...

Gods words, Gods Will, cant be altered, only misunderstood and contorted...

likewise, i dont have a need to prove that this particular church has done outreach to every muzzie in the world, you seem to think that *if* theyve done so, it would then be ok for them to turn their backs on the muzzies...

the history of the entire CHRISTian world shows outreach has been tried, and for the most part failed...rabid animals that would blow themselves up over someone elses book are beyond human aid...

The Lord puts the people in place[s] to witness and to receive the call...any muzzies that are on the fence may finally realize that their death cult is evil and finally be enlightened, as well as CHRISTian like yerself that seem to believe that the *religion* of pieces is basically *good*...

blindly walking into a den of wolves and being eaten isnt required by scripture, Lord Jesus repeats the fact over and over again, that 'the world' is dominated by evil...that there are indeed few who are called...we are surrounded and outnumbered, being easy targets aint healthy...

74 posted on 08/25/2010 6:02:06 AM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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To: Gilbo_3

Peter’s actions were not a defensive use of arms, but an uncommanded attack. Yes, Jesus makes it clear that he does not intend to fight, and nowhere in Scripture does He command any of his disciples to take up swords for the purpose of battling unbelievers.

“the history of the entire CHRISTian world shows outreach has been tried, and for the most part failed...”

Actually, in much of the history of Christianity, where witnessing has occurred, it has produced a harvest. There is a reason that Christianity was the fastest growing religion in the first few centuries, when the early Christians were passionate about evangelism, and the lack of any current American revivals (very few American Christians take the commandment to make disciples seriously).

If you do not witness, you cannot have a harvest. We are commanded to make disciples. How many disciples do you suppose will be made as a result of this church’s decision to make a political statement?


75 posted on 08/25/2010 6:09:00 AM PDT by Immerito
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To: Gilbo_3

“Peters lack of proficiency notwithstanding, if he wasnt meant to use it, why did he have it in the garden, where they were all simpy going to pray ???”

He had it in the garden because most people in that time carried some sort of weapon wherever they went for defense against robbers, etc; that does not mean that he was meant to use it against the servant.

As mentioned, there is NO scriptural basis for Christians to take up a sword and smite unbelievers. We are to pray for them, witness to them and disciple them when they convert. They are to know us by our love-—and love for sinners is certainly not the message that this particular church is sending.


76 posted on 08/25/2010 6:16:22 AM PDT by Immerito
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