Posted on 08/09/2010 8:23:26 AM PDT by COUNTrecount
The Senate health care bill just signed contains some exemptions to the "pay-or-play" mandate requiring purchase of Obamacare-approved health insurance or payment of a penalty fine. As Fox News has pointed out, for instance, the Amish are excused from the mandate:
So while most Americans would be required to sign up with insurance companies or government insurance plans, the church would serve as something of an informal insurance plan for the Amish.
Law experts say that kind of exemption withstands scrutiny.
"Here the statute is going to say that people who are conscientiously opposed to paying for health insurance don't have to do it where the conscientious objection arises from religion," said Mark Tushnet a Harvard law professor. "And that's perfectly constitutional."
Apparently, this exemption will apply similarly to believers in Islam, which considers health insurance - and, for that matter, any form of risk insurance - to be haraam (forbidden).
Steve Gilbert of Sweetness & Light calls our attention to the probability that Muslims will also be exempt. According to a March 23 publication on an authoritative Islamic Web site managed by Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid, various fatwas (religious decrees) absolutely forbid Muslim participation in any sort of health care or other risk insurance:
Health insurance is haraam like other types of commercial insurance, because it is based on ambiguity, gambling and riba (usury). This is what is stated in fatwas by the senior scholars.
In Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa'imah (15/277) there is a quotation of a statement of the Council of Senior Scholars concerning the prohibition on insurance and why it is haraam:
It says in Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa'imah (15/251):
Firstly: Commercial insurance of all types is haraam because it involves ambiguity, riba, uncertainty, gambling and consuming people's wealth unlawfully, and other shar'i
Secondly: It is not permissible for the Muslim to get involved with insurance companies by working in administration or otherwise, because working in them comes under the heading of cooperating in sin and transgression, and Allaah forbids that as He says: "but do not help one another in sin and transgression. And fear Allaah. Verily, Allaah is Severe in punishment"
[al-Maa'idah 5:2]. End quote.
reservations. And Allaah knows best.
So, it turns out that observant Muslims are not only strictly forbidden from buying any health insurance under the ObamaCare mandate, but may also not even work for any company that provides such insurance or any other form of commercial insurance.
It is not made clear whether or not it is religiously okay to accept "free" non-insured medical care such as that offered in hospital ERs and to some who are covered by Medicaid.
Whether it's all right to serve as a doctor, nurse, or orderly caring for patients whose medical services are being paid for by insurance is not covered in the present response - but one could probably obtain a religious ruling from the Sheikh, whose site welcomes the submission of questions about Islamic law and practices.
WordWayze is the nom de plume of a freelance writer and political pundit who would prefer not to become the object of any attention such has been paid to the Mohammed cartoonists of Denmark and others.
About 20 years later, these incidents worked their way though the courts and the IRS created a special religious exemption as a result.
By the mid-1970's (when people in large numbers first begin to realize that Social Security was nothing more than a pyramid scheme), hundreds of thousands of people begin applying for the same religious exemption. I was one of them. The IRS simply issued a ruling for a blanket denial unless the religious order was in effect and recognized at the time of the 1950's ruling.
I think the government still has a file on the rest of us who applied but were denied under that ruling.
I’ll have to go back to my roots. My father was a chiropractor and does not believe in the medical profession or anything the medical profession stands for.
“It cannot be emphasized too clearly and too often that this nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religion, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason, peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here.” [Patrick Henry, May 1765 Speech to the House of Burgesses]
This Republic cannot servive without ONE source of moral standards. Carving out special groups for special laws will certainly doom this nation to failure and will probably result in Sharia law for the entire world. We must return to the foundations this nation was built on.
>>>>I never realized how Amish I was before... imagine that
Me too. :)
Amish do not pay social security. They have an agreement with the feds that they will take care of their own. I don’t know about Medicare but I bet they don’t pay that either.
They don’t pay property taxes because they rotate the meeting place for religious services around every household.
They also make a moderately good living because although they don’t farm many acres they also don’t have much in equipment costs.
I hadn’t thought of that but it almost makes sense, doesn’t it.
Can I be Amish and still plug things in?
As to the Muslim part, does this include car insurance? something they must have in most every state to drive. What about state provided health insurance?
If they just run to the ER or DR office when they need something and pay cash, fine. If they run to the ER because they have no money, and no insurance. They are part of the problem.
Hmmmm....wonder if Scientologists will accept this mandate? Or even Christian Scientiests, and some other religions that have very different ideas about hospitals, doctors, medicine and medical insurance. I think there is a Pandora’s box that will soon be opened regarding religious beliefs and mandated health insurance programs and the requirements of this bill. Note: What a conflict there could be between those liberal Hollywoodians who advocate Scientology and have supported Obama, LOL!!!
Scouts Out! Cavalry Ho!
Thank you. Did a search, nothing came up.
The bearded gentlemen smiled at me and said the key is the word "own". The tools belonged to the subcontractor who hired them. They were just using them to do the job.
He even gave me a catalog of tools they could own-- everything from kitchen gadgets to mechanical tools. None required electricity, power or batteries of any type. I bought a few to use in my garage if everything collapses. I think the Amish will suffer a lot less than most of us in such an event.
I never realized how much I like those Little House on the Prairie dresses either.
If we are paying a tax that Muslims don’t have to pay, we basically just became Dhimmis.
I bet they are wishing that this little bit of info did not come out until after the elections.....
That’s it! I’m painting my wrangler black, putting a red triangle reflector on the back and a card board horse cut out on the front.
James 5:14-15: "Is any among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord: and the prayer of faith shall save him that is sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, it shall be forgiven him." (ASV) This appears to be a guarantee of recovery for anyone who goes through a specific religious ritual, led by elders from his church. Not only healing would be automatically accomplished, but the formerly ill person would have his sins forgiven.
If Muslims can be exempted on the grounds of religious objection, Catholics and evangelical Protestants should also be exempted.
Amish do pay property taxes like everyone else. Rotating meeting places does not give them a tax exemption.
The Amish do pay in cash and have community fundraisers if the bill gets too expensive. Many times they will opt not to take expensive treatment if it’s not cost effective and willingly face death sooner rather than bankrupt the community.
Some variants of the Amish (New Order, some Beachy Amish, and others) maintain government exemption from insurance but are more lenient on technology use. All of them will make you wear old-fashioned clothes though.
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