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To: LouAvul

The rifles now referred to as “assault rifles” came to be in the latter years of WWll, when the Germans found that the full-house infantry round, the 8x57mm Mauser, was uncontrollable in a rifle-weight shoulder-fired weapon. The devised the MP-44 “Sturmgewhre”, a rifle featuring select fire and firing a less-powerful cartrige, the 8x33mm. Mikhail Kalasnikov applied the concept to his AK-47. The definition of “assault rifle by the military is a select-fire rifle of INTERMEDIATE POWER.
The M-14 was unmanagable in full-auto fire. The old BAR was capable of select fire but tipped the scales at 20 lbs.
I have seen AR-15s used in high power rifle competitions at 600 yards but it requires an 80gr. bullet with a different rate of twist in the barrel rifling. There is a difference between punching a hole in a piece of paper and making certain that SOB 600 yards out is down for the count. The M-4 is a cut-down M-16. In making it more compact for urban warfare, a good deal of velocity was sacrifices, further reducing the effectiveness of a marginally effective round.
It is difficult to build a rifle that will do all things for all people but in the end, ya gotta have enough gun


38 posted on 05/22/2010 1:05:25 PM PDT by JayVee (Joseph)
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To: JayVee

My understanding is that since WWII, marksmanship was considered less important than firepower. Standard military doctrine for small-units revolves around suppressing the enemy with high firepower while a second team maneuvers in close for the kill. If further out, then you call in air strikes or artillery. But generally you try to avoid a marksmanship contest.

Of course, according to the NYTimes, Afghan (and Taliban) marksmanship is terrible:
http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/02/the-weakness-of-taliban-marksmanship/


47 posted on 05/22/2010 2:05:20 PM PDT by too_cool_for_skool
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To: JayVee
The old BAR was capable of select fire but tipped the scales at 20 lbs.

The select-fire feature was dropped from the BAR design fairly early. My Father-in-Law carried one in the Marines in Korea. Full-auto only.

61 posted on 05/22/2010 5:25:38 PM PDT by Tallguy ("The sh- t's chess, it ain't checkers!" -- Alonzo (Denzel Washington) in "Training Day")
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To: JayVee
The M-4 is a cut-down M-16. In making it more compact for urban warfare, a good deal of velocity was sacrificed, further reducing the effectiveness of a marginally effective round.

Excellent point! If I remember correctly, the current 62 grain bullet will fracture at the cannelure if it impacts with enough velocity, which at least gives you two wound tracks from each hit. The M-16 will therefore have a better chance of getting the job done (in terms of terminal ballistics) in any given situation. Maybe we should at least look at putting M-4 buttstocks on flat top M-16s and split the difference (the Canadians have or had a model like that)...

66 posted on 05/22/2010 7:41:36 PM PDT by Who is John Galt? ("Sometimes I have to break the law in order to meet my management objectives." - Bill Calkins, BLM)
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