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To: D-fendr
I really rarely describe anyone’s religion as evil.

Somehow I doubt that.

Or come down hard against someone else’s beliefs.

and that.

Scientology preys on and appeals to a harmful side of human nature,

It appeals to that side of human nature that strives to know more and be better. This has been the natural enemy of the Church since time immemorial.

It’s closest cousin is Satanism.

Probably. After all Satan's big crime was wanting to be as good as God.

The ties between Hubbard and Aleister Crowley are well documented.

Yup. The OT (Operating Thetan) levels, unlike everything else in scn dont start with a zero level, I guess the old guy thought OT0 looked too much like OTO (Ordo Templi Orientis, Crowley's group)

The appeal may be “self improvement,” but it’s for personal power over others.

Not for all in the church, I knew many members who were sincere in their quest for personal best.

The appeal may be to “help” the planet, but underneath is the real appeal of personal power over others.

In way too many cases, yes.

If you reinforce the “good” of accomplishing success according to Hubbard, you feed this evil nature. All the good “cheese” is to a bad end.

If I deny the workable parts, I weaken both my own personal integrity and my warning message.

If what appealed to someone about Scientology still appeals to them, they’re not free. If you reinforce this desire in others, how tasty the cheese is,

That model works for alcoholism, but most people who partied through college can still enjoy an occasional beer with ther buds without wanting to go back to their party days.

even if they leave Scientology, their root cause for joining remains.

I still desire to make the world a better place, this is bad because?

50 posted on 05/15/2010 10:26:49 AM PDT by null and void (We are now in day 478 of our national holiday from reality. - 0bama really isn't one of US.)
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To: null and void
I do appreciate that you agree with the main substance of my characterization and description of Scientology. However, then comes some very contradictory points.

It appeals to that side of human nature that strives to know more and be better.

How in the world you can extol the virtues of a religion seeped in satanism and black magic in order to "be better" is perplexing. Power at the expense of others, using others for selfish gain - only in an upside down value system is this considered "being better."

This has been the natural enemy of the Church...

Most certainly, Christianity, for one example, opposes this value system. One need not belong to any church, only have decent human values, to oppose this value system.

I knew many members who were sincere in their quest for personal best.

Everyone wants to be their best, but this value is in service to higher values, not at the expense of them. And for those in Scientology seeking to 'be their best' at what point should they discover this is not a Dale Carnegie course? The second day?

If I deny the workable parts, I weaken both my own personal integrity and my warning message.

Like using a dictionary can improve your vocabulary? Good grief, do you have a long list of "good benefits" from following and promoting evil? Do they dress well, have nicely appointed offices too?

I still desire to make the world a better place, this is bad because?

How long did it take you to discover Scientology wasn't social services? And how long did you stay a member "To make the world a better place"?

If you want to make the world a better place, truly better, not increase your power over others, using this as an excuse to yourself, would only be credible for the absolute clueless.

You agree this is based in the same poison as satanism, you must know it bears no resemblance to any sane self help or charitable organization. It's literally painfully obvious within a short time frame in Scientology. Those that stay are hooked following the same goals as Hubbard and Crowley - far far from "being your best" and "helping the world".

To claim otherwise must rely on ignorance of those you claim it to, or - perhaps in addition to - self denial.

You admit the evil foundation of the cult yet you, amazingly, serve as its apologist. There is no sane apologist argument possible, not for any aspect of it.

52 posted on 05/17/2010 2:15:04 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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To: null and void
Probably [It’s closest cousin is Satanism]. After all Satan's big crime was wanting to be as good as God.

Is this really your understanding of Satan? Or are you just trying to slam Christianity and make a joke?

53 posted on 05/17/2010 2:20:04 PM PDT by D-fendr (Deus non alligatur sacramentis sed nos alligamur.)
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