Old MCA model from last year
Posted on 04/22/2010 5:55:29 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
India Develops Requirements For AMCA
Apr 21, 2010
By Neelam Mathews
mathews.neelam@gmail.com
NEW DELHI
India’s Aeronautical Development Agency is evaluating Indian air force requirements for the Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft (AMCA).
The weight of the AMCA will not exceed 25 tons. The twin-engine configured aircraft will have a higher thrust being in the bigger weight category than the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA), with an active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar.
The Defense Research & Development Organization (DRDO) had announced earlier this year that the AMCA program would be launched in 2010. While unofficially work has started on the design, according to an official, the AMCA will be officially announced in 6-8 months. “There is nothing official about it… It is currently not a sanctioned project from the government. We are looking at the technical requirements submitted by the Indian air force,” the official told Aerospace DAILY.
The AMCA was earlier called the Medium Combat Aircraft. This [AMCA] is very different from the design of the MCA,” an official says.
The Medium Multi Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) that India is currently evaluating bids for is a 4.5-generation aircraft, an official says. “None of the contenders fall in the stealth configuration, which is the most important consideration for the AMCA.”
India hopes to develop stealth technologies indigenously. “We are looking at stealth features even for the LCA,” the official says. “We believe it can be developed here.”
Not having chosen an engine as yet, it is likely that the Kaveri Mk-2 engine presently being developed by Snecma and Gas Turbine Research Establishment will be used for the AMCA.
Kaveri was first conceived as an engine for the LCA developed by ADA. The LCA is currently powered by General Electric-404 engines with technical evaluations ongoing for a bid for 99 engines. The contenders are the F-414 and EJ-200.
Old MCA model from last year
I've always wondered why Russia-India-Israel; or India-Israel; or India-Israel-France would not come together and share costs in regards to 5th generation warplanes. After all, already they have been doing a lot of similar work already (e.g. the SU-30MKI, which has a mix of Russia, Indian, Israeli and French pixie dust; or even the recently launched stealth Frigate, which has Russian skin but a mix of Indo-Israeli-Ruskie innards). It has already been happening for quite some time now, so why not push it into the next arena? India would get something really great, Russia would be able to get a better funding structure(although their economy no longer needs it - it is not 1996), the French would be able to spread costs dramatically, and Israel would not only manage costs better but also not have to jump through the same hoops it did, and currently still is, for the F-35. The four could come up with something truly magnificent.
Anyways ....
I've always wondered why Russia-India-Israel; or India-Israel; or India-Israel-France would not come together and share costs in regards to 5th generation warplanes. After all, already they have been doing a lot of similar work already (e.g. the SU-30MKI, which has a mix of Russia, Indian, Israeli and French pixie dust; or even the recently launched stealth Frigate, which has Russian skin but a mix of Indo-Israeli-Ruskie innards). It has already been happening for quite some time now, so why not push it into the next arena? India would get something really great, Russia would be able to get a better funding structure(although their economy no longer needs it - it is not 1996), the French would be able to spread costs dramatically, and Israel would not only manage costs better but also not have to jump through the same hoops it did, and currently still is, for the F-35. The four could come up with something truly magnificent.
Anyways ....
The MCA (now that AMCA) was always meant to be an indigenous product, at least on paper and was intended to be a multi-role strike aircraft. Unlike the PAK-FA, which despite an Indian variant remains a Russian product.
I’d think that the South Korean KFX project is closest to the MCA/AMCA in concept and it’s a pity that the two countries haven’t teamed up.Saab had offered a pretty neat concept to the ROKAF recently-
http://img48.imageshack.us/i/ksaab248oe9.jpg/
Interesting concept - essentially what the Gripen NG would be were it twin engined and stealthy. Very interesting, and a concept that could have quite the future. Imagine if the MRCA had included this? SAAB truly does punch above its weight
Very interesting concept, though the tech base required to build such an aircraft is 20 years beyond what indigenous Indian tech can currently deliver.
Unlike the Chicoms who only need two years to steal all the requisite tech.
It takes not just the designs, but an entire Industrial infrastructure to build these things. The entire design of the F-22 could be handed over to India today and they wouldn’t be able to duplicate it. India doesn’t even have the technology to build the tools that would be needed to build F-22s. And this is not to bash India, that country is more advanced than 4/5 of the countries in the world.
Sure, it probably lacks the base but unlike the Chicoms, it doesn’t steal, which is why the Russians and Europeans have been more open to technology transfers. China has been building aircraft in their thousands since the 50s, but it is yet to develop a reliable turbofan engine and has to rely on Russian and European models.
“but it is yet to develop a reliable turbofan engine and has to rely on Russian and European models.”
That is largely not true. The Indigenous WS-10 Engines have already been certified and has equipped 2 regiments of the J-11B aircrafts. WS-9 Engines have been certified and has equipped 5 regiments of JH-8As.
The only major engine not certified and in mass production at this point is the WS-10A (meant for the J-10B fighter). So yes, J-10s at this point still relies on imported Russian AL-31F engines. But then again, the WS-10A is supposed to be certified for mass production by end of this year.
The bottom line is that the Chinese military industrial complex is, at this point, largely independent of the main suppliers (U.S, EU, Russia).
The amazing thing is how proud they are of their mimicry. A Chinese official at one of the car companies was so proud of a Rolls Royce Phantom copy (a rather ugly one at that, which had only ONE SEAT at the back). Companies like Geely and Chery have an innovative cycle that is woeful ...they'd rather just mix and match designs from better car marques (e.g. their BMW X5 look alike, or that sad attempt at a Mercedes). Oh, and then there are the legions of Toyota and Honda wannabe designs.
China is an ape scratching the ground with a crooked stick after seeing humans tilling the ground! A nation that prides itself as an innovative super-power, when the fact is that the City-state of Singapore, or a country like South Korea, has more true innovation than the whole of China combined.
China is a joke. A powerful and potent economically joke, but a joke nonetheless.
Of course China has to copy technology. What do you expect them to do? Re-invent the wheel?
China, as of the 1980s, was a pre-industrial agrarian backwater. The FIRST thing they need to do is to catch-up in terms of technology to the advanced nations of Europe and North America. Only then can true innovations occur. Japan, America, Russia all did the same things, why should China be judged by a different metric?
For China, it is better to be a militarily, economically, and technologically potent nation than to worry about copy right infringements at this point. When they reach technological maturity in a particular field, only then, should they be concerned about safeguarding their own innovations from other nations, not a moment before that. This is the military development path that should(and was) taken by all established industrialized countries.
OTOH, China can play nice like all the other “developing” countries in the world, and remain technologically 40 years behind the West(as India is currently doing). While I’m sure the U.S, EU, and Russia would be quite happy with another cash cow for their arms industry, it’s not really in China’s interest is it now?
Yawn, the same stuff you find on Chicom fanboy forums. That’s the only place you’ll find information on all those engines which they claim to have developed. Last time I checked, they were still buying AL-31s from the Russians for the J-10 and 11 and were examining French and British engines for the JH-7.
About being behind, well at least countries like India can at least get legitimate technology transfers while the Chicom republic for all its might still has to beg the Europeans to lift their arms embargo. So much for Chinese independence.
If the last time you checked was 5 years ago...
Oh well, last time I checked, the fanboys sites were talking about the PLAAF planning to have half a dozen stealth fighter variants.
Last time I checked the talk was on how the J-10 would become better than even future upgrades on the Eurofighter-Typhoon. Chicom land has a direct drip on crack! They produce an untermensch copy of something and believe that they have invented a starship. Must be all that lead in the air mucking their brains
We all have to work with what we got.
“Last time I checked the talk was on how the J-10 would become better than even future upgrades on the Eurofighter-Typhoon.”
It is a distinct possibility that future upgraded variants of the J-10 can exceed future upgraded Euro-Fighter variants in some areas. Much of this depends on whether funding continues for follow-up versions of both aircrafts.
The J10 is a creation largely 'inspired' from the Lavi and was supposed to be a high energy multi-role platform. The J10 has managed to achieve that, and (if we ignore its inception history) will meet China's needs for something they can mass produce. The Eurofighter Typhoon was created to be a superlative fighter that was designed to outperform future Soviet fighters (now coming out - the more advanced SU-30 Flankers and the SU-35), and to evolve to match evolutionary growth in those as well (e.g. as the SU35 evolves). The Eurofighter Typhoon is beyond anything that the J10 could ever.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
