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To: Paladin2
Don't forget tht Israel attacked the ship b/c they din't want the world to know THEY initiated the Six-Day War, and not the Egyptians like they claimed. Additionally, the Israelis were using tank main guns against civilians.

Also, Amerian troops aboard the ship waved at the IDF pilots, when the pilots banked and opened fire. Thinking that the Israelis didn't recognize the ship as American, the American troops lowered the flag on the ship and put up a bigger one..... the Israelis banked and opened fire again.

The ship released the lifeboats and on the third strafe, the Israelis blew the lifeboats out of the water. The ship drifted into water that was too shallow to deploy the ditch bags (containg Top Secret radio intercepts and other classified) and were in danger of floating into water too shallow to scuttle the ships.

The ship's captain requsted F-16 support from American stationed in Saudi Arabia; the response was the jets were en-route. The Israelis left the area to avid air to air conflict with American pilots. Fortunately, the Israelis never realized that the F-16s did not receive runway/tower/air space clearance from the Saudis.

The USS Liberty was able limp to port. And since it was no longer under threat, the classified information was not ditched and that is how we came to know of thecircumstances regarding the Six-Day War.

A gag order was placed against the entire crew of the USS Liberty. The Israelis claimed they mistook the ship for an Egyptian one.......that was not comparable in size or appearnce to the USS Liberty. US servicemen that were wounded, blinded, maimed, and the families of those killed, filed a lawsuit against the Israeli government but could not proceed because of the offical gag order...... the captain of the USS Liberty broke his silence on his deathbed something like 20 years after the incident.

All of that said, yes the US and Israel have a strong binding history of friendship; however, they look after and protect Israel's nterests first and foremost. They cannot be faulted for this, every country does this and should do this as a sovereing nation.... including the United States.

While the US was on the receiving end of this attack, Israel obviously felt it was in protection of their interests to destroy an American spy ship (which is what it was). Likewise, Israel cannot expect the US to put the interests of Israel above our own. The US has a duty first and foremost to US inteests..... including the tens of tousands of US troops in th region. Now, the powers that be may allow Israel use of US controlled airspace if it wil not hinder US interests.... but no one should just assue it so.

FYI.... source of info for this post is Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Security Agency by James Bamford.

It is a very well researched and informative book concerning some of the US' intelligence successes and failures.

76 posted on 04/21/2010 9:26:38 AM PDT by Repeat Offender (While the wicked stand confounded, call me with Thy Saints surrounded)
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To: Repeat Offender

“Don’t forget tht Israel attacked the ship b/c they din’t want the world to know THEY initiated the Six-Day War, and not the Egyptians like they claimed.”

Absolutely. When Nassar ordered the UN troops out of the Sinai and U Thant complied immediately, it was because the Egyptians were going to invite the Israelis to a big ol’ bar-b-que.

Or are you going to claim that the Israelis should have waited until a whole bunch of Jews were killed before they responded?

I give Paladin more credit. There had to be valid reasons. Bamford’s fall way short.


99 posted on 04/21/2010 9:45:00 AM PDT by avoth
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To: Repeat Offender

“The ship’s captain requsted F-16 support from American stationed in Saudi Arab”
F-16s weren’t produced until 1976 or 77.


107 posted on 04/21/2010 9:52:36 AM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Repeat Offender

I don’t believe the captain of the Liberty request air support from F-16s.

The Six Day War was in June, 1967.....the first F-16 didn’t fly until February, 1974. The aircraft started joining operational squadrons circa 1976 - 1978.


119 posted on 04/21/2010 9:58:00 AM PDT by july4thfreedomfoundation (I'm voting for Sarah Palin because she pisses off the right people.)
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To: Repeat Offender
The ship's captain requsted F-16 support...

What year was this?

127 posted on 04/21/2010 10:09:14 AM PDT by TankerKC (I think P. T. Barnum had his time off by about 59 seconds.)
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To: Repeat Offender
Amerian troops aboard the ship waved at the IDF pilots, when the pilots banked and opened fire. Thinking that the Israelis didn't recognize the ship as American, the American troops lowered the flag on the ship and put up a bigger one..... the Israelis banked and opened fire again. The ship released the lifeboats and on the third strafe, the Israelis blew the lifeboats out of the water.

Dam. I didn't know jets could fly that slow. Sounds like BS.

132 posted on 04/21/2010 10:15:50 AM PDT by McGruff (So how is that Hopey Changey thingy working out for ya America?)
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To: Repeat Offender

What the hell was that? Using main guns against Civilians? F-16s? When did the liberty happen? I thought it was in 67 or 73?


143 posted on 04/21/2010 10:31:24 AM PDT by crazydad (What)
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To: Repeat Offender
You have no idea WTH you're talking about. F-16s based in Saudi Arabia in 1967?? Yeah, right, the F-16 did not exist in those days and there were no US fighter bases in Saudi-land in those days. You are trying to refer to F-4s from the US 6th Fleet in the Mediterranean, but you ought to learn a bit about the facts before you try to recite them to others. As for the start of the "Six Day War"..... it was always perfectly well known to all that Israel launched pre-emptive strikes BECAUSE Nasser had kicked UN "peace keeping" troops out of the way while he massed his army on Israel's southern/eastern border in obvious preparation for attack. No special intel was needed to know that Israel struck the first blows then, just in advance of Nasser's obvious moves to invade Israel.

"The ship's captain requsted F-16 support from American stationed in Saudi Arabia; the response was the jets were en-route. The Israelis left the area to avid air to air conflict with American pilots. Fortunately, the Israelis never realized that the F-16s did not receive runway/tower/air space clearance from the Saudis."
182 posted on 04/21/2010 12:17:49 PM PDT by Enchante (Obama and Brennan think that 20% of terrorists re-joining the battle is just fine with them)
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To: Repeat Offender
Don't forget tht Israel attacked the ship b/c they din't want the world to know THEY initiated the Six-Day War, and not the Egyptians like they claimed.

The Egyptians initiated the war when they blockaded the port of Eilat in the Red Sea on May 22-23, 1967. Just thought I'd make that correction.
205 posted on 04/21/2010 3:57:09 PM PDT by UnbelievingScumOnTheOtherSide (NEW TAG ====> **REPEAL OR REBEL!** -- Islam Delenda Est! -- Rumble thee forth)
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To: Repeat Offender; jhpigott
Why do I bother?

Radio transcripts prove taht the Israelis thought it was a SOVIET ship. And this was the fault of the NSA. Israel had requested a naval liaison, but were denied. Had thee been one, no such acidental misidentification would have occurred. LBJ had promised the Israelis to keep our ships west of Cyprus. The NSA placed an American ship into a war zone, after we lied to at least one party. As far as I am concerned, someone at the NSA should have been tried for murder. But No Such Agency is never held accountable.

Don't forget tht Israel attacked the ship b/c they din't want the world to know THEY initiated the Six-Day War, and not the Egyptians like they claimed. Additionally, the Israelis were using tank main guns against civilians. So the United Arab republic did not close the Red Sea and did not shell Israel?
Tank guns against civilians? You are not even quoting the hack Bamford properly. His thesis is taht Israel attacked the liberty to hide a massacre of Egyptian troops. (No such massacre occurred)

Also, Amerian troops aboard the ship waved at the IDF pilots, when the pilots banked and opened fire. Thinking that the Israelis didn't recognize the ship as American, the American troops lowered the flag on the ship and put up a bigger one..... the Israelis banked and opened fire again.
Look up the attack on the HMS Sheffield by pilots from the HMS Ark Royal and get back to me.

The ship's captain requsted F-16 support from American stationed in Saudi Arabia; the response was the jets were en-route. The Israelis left the area to avid air to air conflict with American pilots. Fortunately, the Israelis never realized that the F-16s did not receive runway/tower/air space clearance from the Saudis.
Oy vey!
There were no F-16s in 1967. There were no American fighters in Saudia Arabia in 1967. You don't know what the he!! you are talking about.

A gag order was placed against the entire crew of the USS Liberty. The Israelis claimed they mistook the ship for an Egyptian one.......that was not comparable in size or appearnce to the USS Liberty. US servicemen that were wounded, blinded, maimed, and the families of those killed, filed a lawsuit against the Israeli government but could not proceed because of the offical gag order...... the captain of the USS Liberty broke his silence on his deathbed something like 20 years after the incident.
Idiot. This was investigated three times!

It is a very well researched and informative book concerning some of the US' intelligence successes and failures.
Actually, it's a fraud.

217 posted on 04/21/2010 5:06:39 PM PDT by rmlew (There is no such thing as a Blue Dog Democrat; just liberals who lie.)
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