Posted on 04/20/2010 12:47:47 AM PDT by hope
Nope. That's not what she said.
Read the damned statement.
You should take your own advice.
No Obot, the corrupt Obama team posted 2 forgeries and passed them off as the same document. The first one was posted by the DailyKooks at the DailyKos.org on the 12th of June 2008, which was later posted by the Kool-aid drinkers at "Fight the Smears" Obama's official website. The second one was to cover up the deficiencies of the first one, which was posted at "FactCheck".org in the 1st week of August, 08. And Obot, you'll never see either of those two forgeries from the inside of any courtroom submitted as evidence - never. Because the Obama COLB forgery would be subject to verification of his vital records in Hawaii. Obama is not about to let that happen if he can help it.
The “FIGHT THE SMEARS” website was an official sub-division of the “Obama For President” campaign. HE is responsible for it.
The Dumbass Obama would still claim 'plausible deniability' if he thought he could get away with it...and probably even if could not. Obama would say I didn't know what those guys were doing on that campaign website. I had thousands of people working on my campaign and noway I could keep track of what they were all doing. It wouldn't work because no one would believe his lying ass.
Once again, neither you nor I have any idea what evidence has been submitted in defendants’ legal briefs to the Courts that have looked at the eligibility issue.
Where have you been? Their briefs are on public display.
Just because you call something a forgery doesn’t make it so.
But it is in this case.
Back in August of 2008, WorldNetDaily, not exactly a pro-Obot website had its own independent forgery experts examine the Obama online COLB and they concluded that it was “most likely” authentic.
I don't see anywhere that WND believes in those clowns at Factcheck.org in the article you posted. And I see you left off the clowns at 'Factcheck' in your post above. LOL!
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there.
WND doesn't name the person(s) who said it was 'authentic'. Obviously we know now those/that guy(s) was wrong from your August 23rd, 2008 article. And in the same WND article, is most likely referring to 'Techdude' who claimed it was Maya's COLB that was used as a template used for the Obama COLB DailyKook.org forgery, which did not hold up to scrutiny. He's been discredited.
However, a few months later WND ran this story:
Posted: December 01, 2008 10:20 pm Eastern
By Bob Unruh
It was Polarik's analysis of the Obama COLB and which has stood up to scrutiny despite all the Obots who tried to say otherwise.
This time, WND names this independent expert here in the same article who said,
"Dan Purdy of Forensic Document Examination Services Inc. told WND that the origins of the Internet images aren't known. He raised questions over whether the "original" was a photocopy, the equipment used to create the digital image and the compression processes of the various formats. "
Furthermore in the same December 1st article,
"WND columnist Janet Porter has written extensively about the birth certification issue...
She also noted the issue won't go away, and recommended a visit to ObamaForgery.com to review what's happening.
"These are the facts," she wrote. "The Constitution requires the president to be a natural born citizen. Obama's grandmother said she was there when Barack was born in Kenya. Obama refuses to release his original birth certificate. Instead of a birth certificate, Obama's campaign posted a certification given to those born abroad. Experts have called even that document an 'obvious forgery.'"
"Our Constitution still matters," she said."
-end snip-
So Obot, do you really think World Net Daily really believes Obama's Hawaiian COLB that are posted online are genuine - do you?
The newspaper says 'Health Bureau' and we don't know if the listings were placed by that department or if the newspapers sent a reporter to the registrar's office to get the listings. The number of days isn't at issue, except as it relates to the certificate number.
2) We know it must have been registered as taking place in Hawaii because Fukino verified that the vital records show birth in Hawaii.
No. We don't know this at all. She said unspecified vital records 'verify' the place of birth as Hawaii, but she doesn't say that this information is contained on the original birth certificate.
Therefore, the only possible way Obama could have been born outside of Hawaii is if someone committed fraud and registered his birth to be within state.
Again, this is why we need to see original records.
Under the law, a timely birth registration such as Obama's enjoys the presumption of accuracy.
Too bad we don't know what details are included on the birth registration.
Therefore, you argue that all of Obama's documents protected by privacy laws should be disclosed.
Obama is a public figure and a public servant. He released his income tax records. He has the same expectation to be transparent for his birth records when there are obvious problems.
Unfortunately, it is not uncommon for US-born Children of immigrants to think of their parents' country of origin as their "home country."
Obama is not the child of an immigrant and we don't know whether he was U.S. born or not.
Here's a question I'd like to see a birther answer. What makes you so sure birth certificate numbers always came in the same order as the births?
Didn't say it was in the order of births. The give-away is the publication in the newspaper. Spokesbabe Okubo says the state applies the certificate number when the certificate is filed with the state. Obama's COLB says it was filed Aug. 8, and it was published Aug. 13. The Nordyke twins COLBs were filed three days later and published three days later. Other known certificate numbers are consistent at being low at the beginning of the year and higher at the end of the year. The incriminating part is that the DOH refuses to confirm the number as belonging to Obama despite having full legal authority. Other states issue certificate numbers along with index data.
No, you have a document's scanned image whose proportions don't exactly match that of the same document's photographs.
The scans show an edge to the document that is not matched by the document in the photographs. The only way to explain this is if the paper grew or if one or both documents are fraudulent.
The DOH can't confirm the authenticity of an internet image. Why you should consider this as evidence of anything is baffling.
Your arguments are getting progressively weaker and weaker. The alleged COLB is supposed to be a database-generated abstract of the original birth certificate. The DOH has all the factual details it needs to confirm the jpg, but refuse in spite of having protection under the state's sunshine laws to confirm the information, thus confirming the alleged COLB. Why settle for lame excuses and misdirection??
As far as I can tell, it has violated no law. If you think otherwise, please specify the exact law that was violated.
They explain one law they violated on their Barack Hussein Obama FAQ page, which says: "State law prohibits the DOH from disclosing any vital statistics records or information contained in such records unless the requestor has a direct and tangible interest in the record, or as otherwise allowed by statute or administrative rule." They cite HRS §338-18(b). By this claim, they cannot reveal that Obama was born in Hawaii or that he is a 'natural born American citizen.' By the way, their administrative rules say they can release non-certified copies of vital records to anyone, not just persons with a direct and tangible interest. An opinion letter posted by the Office of Information Practices says the DOH can release certificate numbers to the public. So far, the DOH has refused such requests. Requests were made for divorce records upon which Spokesbabe Okubo said her department didn't handle divorce records. Their own Web site says they do. "Vital records (birth, death, marriage, and divorce certificates) on file with the Department of Health may be amended (i.e., changes, corrections, additions, deletions, or substitutions) upon submission of the required documentation."
Yes, some 'native-born' individuals were still considered natural born subjects of Great Britain during this time. This was acknowledged by Shanks v. Dupont. Those, native or otherwise, who adhered to the crown were subjects. Those who adhered to the United States were citizens. It was one or the other, not both. IOW, being native born didn't automatically make a person a natural born citizen unless your allegiance was to the United States, which would not be the case if you didn't have citizen parents.
Let me just cut and past the portion of Justice Gray's opinion that cites common law. Knock yourself out.
Again, this is about natural-born subjects and doesn't say anything regarding citizenship. Note that it says that allegiance and protection were 'mutual' and were only good "so long as they [aliens] were within the kingdom." If you were the child of an alien who gave his allegiance to the king and stayed within the kingdom, you would be considered a natural born subject. That's why the Wong decision emphasized that his parents were permanent U.S. residents.
There is nothing in that case that excludes the possiblity that a person might be a natural born citizen of two countries.
Wrong. They cited the Vattel definition of natural born citizen, which is predicated on the citizenship of the father. There's no dual citizenship or dual allegiance in being natural born subjects or natural born citizens.
If you had, you would know that this passage was referring to the citizenship status of people who were living in the USA during the war of independence.
BWAH????? The basis of your argument has been on the English common law that prevailed prior to the U.S. Constitution. Now you don't want it to apply?? Dude, you're shooting yourself in the foot. John Kerry would be proud.
So Obot, do you really think World Net Daily really believes Obama’s Hawaiian COLB that are posted online are genuine - do you?
The ONLY birth certificate that Obama will EVER need to show to anyone is the Hawaii Certification of Live Birth. It meets all the federal requirements for a birth certificate and its printed on safety paper which federal law requires, meaning it cannot be altered or forged while original birth certificates were usually NOT printed on safety paper and therefore they CAN be altered or forged much more easily.
The Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004, Section 7211, mandated that minimum standards be set for birth certificates acceptable for federal purposes. The Department of Health and Human Services (of which the National Center for Health Statistics is a part) was tasked with issuing the standard. The statute defined a “birth certificate” as follows:
(a) DEFINITION- In this section, the term `birth certificate’ means a certificate of birth–
(1) for an individual (regardless of where born)–
(A) who is a citizen or national of the United States at birth; and
(B) whose birth is registered in the United States; and
(2) that–
(A) is issued by a Federal State, or local government agency or authorized custodian of record and produced from birth records maintained by such agency or custodian of record; or
(B) is an authenticated copy, issued by a Federal, State, or local government agency or authorized custodian of record, of an original certificate of birth issued by such agency or custodian of record.
The Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act specifically mandates three categories of minimum standards for vital registration, including standards on (1) the certification of birth certificates and the use of safety paper, (2) proof and verification of identity as a condition of issuance of a birth certificate, and (3) processing of birth certificate applications to prevent fraud.
Any official document issued by the state of Hawaii meets the standards listed above.
Electronic Verification (EVVE)
The DHS rule, Section 37.13(b)(3), specifies that the validity of birth certificates, presented to document the date of birth or to prove U.S. citizenship, should be verified electronically, by accessing the Electronic Verification of Vital Events (EVVE) system maintained by the National Association of Public Health Statistics and Information Systems (NAPHSIS), rather than directly with the issuers of the birth certificates (such as hospitals).
Hawaii was the first state to enact legislation that allowed verification of birth certificate information in lieu of ordering certified copies of vital records and piloted the Electronic Verification of Vital Event (EVVE) system nationally.
“A separate WND investigation into Obama’s birth certificate utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren’t originally there.”-—Worldnetdaily.com
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=73214
I’m trying to understand where you’re coming from. Is it your belief that a valid birth certificate has been produced? Do you believe challenging Onada’s place of birth is a waste of time?
Your mommy Obot is Obama. I did that Obot. I pointed and clicked to your link, and I gave you a later dated and better WND article that contradicted your silly point.
The ONLY birth certificate that Obama will EVER need to show to anyone is the Hawaii Certification of Live Birth.
We haven't seen that Obama COLB in any court of law, and to reiterate, we will never see it there because it is a forgery.
It meets all the federal requirements for a birth certificate and its printed on safety paper which federal law requires, meaning it cannot be altered or forged while original birth certificates were usually NOT printed on safety paper and therefore they CAN be altered or forged much more easily.
That silly thing only exists on the Internet made up as pixels on everyone's computer screens in .jpg and in other picture formats. That Obama COLB is worthless as it does not exist as evidence in court. It will always be worthless except to the fools who are deluded enough to believe in it.
which federal law requires, meaning it cannot be altered or forged while original birth certificates were usually NOT printed on safety paper and therefore they CAN be altered or forged much more easily.
Cannot be altered,or forged? *laugh* Printed on safety paper? Oh sure it is...How about Obama let the world tacitly inspect the document? We are waiting for Obama to prove that it is genuine and waiting and waiting...
(a) DEFINITION- In this section, the term `birth certificate’ means a certificate of birth–....
Back to your favorite BS of cutting and pasting and thinking it proves your silly points.
Have some more and again the Dec 01, 2008 WND article since you like to cut and paste:
Yes, and yes.
Your mommy Obot is Obama. I did that Obot. I pointed and clicked to your link, and I gave you a later dated and better WND article that contradicted your silly point.
“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago.”
To:
Rep. Ann Kirkpatrick
President Barack Obama
Sen. John McCain
Sen. Jon Kyl
April 21, 2010
This is so embarrassing and stupid that I cannot believe that the STATE OF ARIZONA CONGRESS did it. Oh, Lord, I am so ashamed to be an Arizonan right now.
This is pure racism, and I am appalled. Did you do this with the (at least more valid) issue of McCain’s birth? No. The State of Hawaii, the President’s birth place, has repeatedly, officially confirmed his birth. His certified birth certificate is available online, for all the world to see. Are you telling us the State of Hawaii is part of some nefarious conspiracy? Are you nuts? Other Presidents have not been subjected to this. I know, you will say it applies to all. Don’t even bother to write me back, just undo this embarrassing piece of legislation as soon as possible.
Just because you are part of a pack, does not absolve you of personal responsibility in this matter. Nor does it give you leave to make mealy-mouthed justifications, rationalizations, and excuses about your actions.
Whatever the political reactivity that drives you, you need to understand that you are supposed to represent the people of the State of Arizona wisely and well. If you are not wise or well, at least LOOK at what you are doing. Pretend you are professional, mature, and capable of governing appropriately.
I ask again that you immediately un-do this legislation and would appreciate a public apology.
Bwahahaha!
And what I said is because WND had a blurp about that some unkown expert, who they did not name, who believed that on 23rd of August 2008 that the Obama forgery was genuine that you think supports your silly viewpoint that it is true and that WND believed the same. I posted another WND article from December 2008 which shows you that if WND believed anything, they believe that it is a forgery.
“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago.”
It has been documented many many times on FR that the Hawaiian DoH are a deceptive lot who are doing what they can to protect Obama to the point of violating their own policies and laws. Fukino showed her ignorance by declaring Obama a natural born citizen, but we know that his father is a Kenyan who transmitted his British citizenship which later became a Kenyan citizenship to Obama, which makes her statement totally irrelevant.
The phrase "vital records" is legalise deception. What Fukino should have said to be clear is that I saw the original hard copy birth certificate issued in August of 1961, and Obama was born in a hospital in the city of Honolulu.
So what 'vital records' Fukino? Something you may have saw in an amendment to Obamo's complete records? A statement from Grandma Dunham who said Obama was born in Hawaii? An abbreviated abstract to the full and complete records? So again, what vital records Fukino?
Fukino and the state of Hawaii have never officially authenticated the Obama online COLB and they refuse to do so. Hawaii as of late have refused to comment on Fukino's past statements. They are refusing to back up what she has said. Gee I wonder why? Not.
And yet no one has yet discredited it in a court of law, go figure.
Obama has not submitted his sorry forgery of a COLB to any court to be discredited.
Obama is under no obligation to prove anything to anyone.
If lying was a crime, there isn't enough jail space to hold all the Obots who think nothing is immoral about lying there donkey butts off. Lying is a way of life for Obama. Obama is the lying-est US president ever.
I’m sure that he enjoys using the birthers as dupes to solidify his base. Keeping the birth certificate issue alive and winning lawsuit after lawsuit must be great fun for him as a former constitutional law professor.
He hasn't won anything on the merits of the case in federal court since none of them have adjudicated his eligibilty in open court. You keep on having those delusional thoughts after Obama loses the Rat Congress this November. You just uttered a falsehood. Obama was no more than 'lecturer' who got a college teaching job when someone made a phone call moving his butt over many other people who were far more qualified. Obama was no "college law professor".
I like using original sources, sue me! Thanks for the links. Your mommy is a good teacher.
To be more accurate. Your copying and pasting is nothing but a ruse to obfuscate and dilute threads with BS.
I'll be there to say bon voyage when FR zots you...you paid Obot.
Hahaaa...! What a stupid letter. Hey McCain, you go right ahead and denounce the legislation.
Can you tell me where you saw it and is that place accessible to me? There is nothing I desire more than to resolve the doubts in my mind about The Marxist Onada’s birth.
So many of the claims made by birthers have turned out to be false and yet they persist. An example is the difficulties for US citizens traveling to Pakistan in 1961. Another is Polarik's analysis of the CoLB published on the internet.
If you cut through the smoke and mirrors, The Marxist Onada has never presented a credible document proving the US as his birth country; and with which he could legally apply for a US passport.
You’re all wrapped around the axel about whether this or that document may or may not have been forged, tampered with or whatever. The salient point is that none of those documents met the standard for proving one’s birth country.
In debate the tactic is called deflection. Marxists have mastered the technique.
Here is what the Department of State requires straight from the Application For A U.S. Passport
1. PROOF OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP
a. APPLICANTS BORN IN THE UNITED STATES: Submit a previous passport or certified birth certificate. A birth certificate must include your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date birth record was filed, and seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records.
Which of those requirements does Obama's CoLB lack?
There may be some confusion because birth abstracts from California and Texas are not accepted by the DoS when applying for a passport, however Hawaii's short form meets their requirements.
The salient point is that none of those documents met the standard for proving one’s birth country.
Certainly a scanned image published on the internet does not, but the CoLB itself does.
In debate the tactic is called deflection. Marxists have mastered the technique.
If misrepresenting facts is deflection, then the Marxist shoe is on the other foot.
Your obamanoid sycophancy relying on deceit continues to amaze some of us at FR!
Here is what the Department of State requires straight from the Application For A U.S. Passport
1. PROOF OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP
a. APPLICANTS BORN IN THE UNITED STATES: Submit a previous passport or certified birth certificate. A birth certificate must include your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date birth record was filed, and seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records.
Which of those requirements does Obama’s CoLB lack?
There may be some confusion because birth abstracts from California and Texas are not accepted by the DoS when applying for a passport, however Hawaii’s short form meets their requirements.
Polarik's analysis only holds up for those who want to believe and lack expertise.
http://www.hackerfactor.com/blog/index.php?/archives/210-Bad-Science-How-Not-To-Do-Image-Analysis.html
Actually it was Polarik's analysis that began to convince me that the whole issue was bunk. I have worked with more scanned images than I care to recall as a professional and know his analysis is faulty to say the least. Either Polarik doesn't know what he's looking at, or he thinks his audience is too inexperienced to know when he's attempting to pull the wool over their eyes.
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