F-16 sale comes to fore following Chinese jet show

Taipei Times ^ | 4/17/2010 | William Lowther

[ErnstStavroBlofeld]

An expert on military relations said that by the time F-16s could be sold to Taiwan, China would have hundreds of advanced J-10 jet fighters. As China showed off its new J-10 fighter planes this week, Taiwan supporters in the US Congress began pressing the White House once again to sell advanced F-16s to Taipei.

Texas Republican Representative Kay Granger inserted “remarks” into the Congressional Record urging US President Barack Obama to “immediately move ahead with the sale of F-16s to Taiwan.”

And Oklahoma Republican Senator James Inhofe was preparing to introduce a new resolution in the US Senate supporting F-16 sales to Taiwan.

Granger, whose district is home to the Lockheed Martin plant where the F-16s are built, said: “One of the main reasons to move now is that the production of the F-16s is nearing its end as more countries are switching to the advanced F-35 Joint Strike Fighter.”

If Obama agrees to sell the requested 66 advanced F-16C/Ds to Taiwan, it will save about 1,400 Texan jobs.

The potential sale was the subject of new interest among US military circles following an event in Tianjin, China, on Tuesday when the media and more than 50 military attaches from embassies in Beijing were invited to a 15-minute demonstration of the domestically developed J-10.

[STARWISE]

~~Ping!

[DemforBush]

To me, selling some late model F-16’s to Taiwan seems like a no-brainer. An ally gets an upgrade to their air force, and a bunch of folks back home keep their job by producing goods and services.

Of course, our largest debtholder (the PRC) might not like it. I say bollocks to them, though I don’t know if Obama will have the same attitude.

[ErnstStavroBlofeld]

I agree. I believe in giving Taiwan anything they want.

[kbennkc]

I expect the one to cancel support for Taiwan on compassionate grounds . There is no use in them busting up a bunch of good aircraft and a bunch of Free Chinese dying , putting up a struggle to buy time for the cavalry to come , when the commander has no intention of sending them . Obama will be like Benteen and Reno , “ heck wasn't anything we could do anyway , there was too just many of em “ .

[driftdiver]

“Of course, our largest debtholder”

Of course we are their biggest customer.

[Yo-Yo]

F-16 Sale to Taiwan, Would It Make A Difference? Read more: F-16 Sale to Taiwan, Would It Make A Difference?

Snip...

Actually, RAND did the math on this one in a report last year, in typical RAND style, using sophisticated modeling to simulate a Chinese invasion of Taiwan in the 2010–2015 timeframe. RAND’s conclusion was that the addition of a few dozen upgraded F-16s would have little to no impact on the cross-strait balance. In fact, RAND found that in the event of a Chinese attack, “the air war for Taiwan could essentially be over before much of the Blue air force has even fired a shot.”

It’s not the Chinese air fleet that would deliver the knock out blow to Taiwanese air power. Rather, its China’s massive arsenal of ballistic missiles that in an opening salvo would destroy most Taiwanese aircraft, even those in hardened shelters, and wreck its runways before Taiwan was able to launch its fighters.

/snip

[SandRat]

Now we know why the sale will not be done and why OBozo Bowed to the ChiCom Premiere.

It would help defend Taiwan and it would save about 1,400 Texan jobs.

[spetznaz]

Sad, but true. What Taiwan probably needs is a good number of advanced AIP D-E submarines (although, again, China has leveraged upon high technology DE makers like Germany, Sweden and France not to sell to Taiwan), and an extremely comprehensive layered redundant integrated air defense system (turning the island into a no mans zone for anything flying). That would be better than additional Vipers that would not stand up to China. And anyways, if they wanted jets the Gripen is far far FAR better than the Viper for Taiwan's needs. The Gripen NG would have an AESA (although Taiwan could always get an AESA like the RACR or SABR for its Vipers), have missiles like the MEteor (better than an Amraam, and far better than anything China has), and most importantly can land on most of Taiwan's extensive road network (thus China eould be faced with hundreds of targets for its ballistic missiles, rather than a dozen airfields).

A) Get the DE subs by any means necessary ...steal the technology if need be. AIP subs in the littoral waters could make an invasion very costly for China. B) IADS up the wazoo. C) Gripens instead of Vipers. Better plane

[Zhang Fei]

It’s not the Chinese air fleet that would deliver the knock out blow to Taiwanese air power. Rather, its China’s massive arsenal of ballistic missiles that in an opening salvo would destroy most Taiwanese aircraft, even those in hardened shelters, and wreck its runways before Taiwan was able to launch its fighters.

RAND is full of it. During Desert Storm, despite thousands of sorties, Allied forces were never able to either destroy the majority of Iraqi planes or prevent them from taking off. Unless the Chinese use nukes, the hundreds of ballistic missiles they have pointed at Taiwan aren't going to do much against Taiwan's air force, especially given that Chinese ordnance doesn't have the precision of even Desert Storm era bombs.

Saddam basically psyched himself out and sent his planes to Iran, because he believed Iraqi planes could not survive in the air against Allied planes. I don't think the Taiwanese have the problem of technological lag.

[mad_as_he$$]

http://www.megafortress.com/books/book10.htm

[mad_as_he$$]

See post 11. In the book which was written sometime ago the Chi-coms open the war with nukes on several key Taiwanese bases.

[Yo-Yo]

You’d think that if they went to all that trouble to give a B-52 a V-tail and a pointy nose, that they could have ditched the J57 8-pack for something with more thrust and less fuel consumption, like maybe four GEnx-2Bs.

[mad_as_he$$]

EB-52 Megafortress See also: Megafortress Dale Brown has used various modified variants of the B-52 Stratofortress, which in reality is used by the US Air Force as their heavy strategic bomber. These variants are usually referred to as the B-52 Megafortress. The Megafortress first appears in Dale Brown's Flight of the Old Dog and is expanded and upgraded in all his later books. It has all the latest technology (such as an advanced on-board computer and detailed HUD) and carries all the latest weapons, such as the AIM-7 Sparrow, AIM-9 Sidewinder, AIM-120 AMRAAM, along with various anti-ship missiles, anti-tank guided missiles and even more fanciful weapons such as plasma-yield warheads. It also uses an advanced layout, having a long SST nose and twin V-type tails. In later books, the eight engines of the B-52A-H are replaced by four larger and more powerful turbofans. Coincidentally, this is an upgrade that has been considered for the real-world B-52H fleet. In Flight of the Old Dog, the first book in the series, the aircraft is designated the B-52I Megafortress. B-52M Megafortress Plus is later introduced in Day of the Cheetah and the EB-52 designation is first used in Sky Masters. In reality, the EB-52H (or B-52J) was a planned upgrade to the USAF's current fleet of Stratofortresses, allowing them to act as "stand-off jammers", with jamming pods replacing the B-52's wing-mounted external fuel tanks. One final version, the AL-52 Dragon, was introduced in Wings of Fire. The Dragon is an airborne laser platform; the actual laser is a chemical system (a COIL, or chlorine-oxygen-iodine laser). One prototype, however, is refitted with a plasma-pumped solid-state laser (the technology is based on the plasma-yield warheads mentioned above). Both Dragon variants are devastating against aerial targets; however, the plasma-pumped laser's sheer power makes it effective against surface targets as well. Later on in the series, the plasma-pumped solid state laser replaces the COIL laser on all standard AL-52's.

[Yo-Yo]

Ah, thanks. I never read past Old Dog.

[mad_as_he$$]

I recommend that you read all of Dale's books if you can. He has a way of predicting technology that is interesting. Fatal Terrain about the Chi-coms attacking Taiwan is very good and I think he must be inside some Chinese General’s head.

[mad_as_he$$]

I recommend that you read all of Dale's books if you can. He has a way of predicting technology that is interesting. Fatal Terrain about the Chi-coms attacking Taiwan is very good and I think he must be inside some Chinese General’s head.