Posted on 03/26/2010 3:44:57 PM PDT by SE Mom
According to a report by Congress's Joint Committee on Taxation, the individual mandate in Obamacare lacks any real enforcement mechanism:
The penalty applies to any period the individual does not maintain minimum essential coverage and is determined monthly. The penalty is assessed through the Code and accounted for as an additional amount of Federal tax owed. However, it is not subject to the enforcement provisions of subtitle F of the Code. The use of liens and seizures otherwise authorized for collection of taxes does not apply to the collection of this penalty. Non-compliance with the personal responsibility requirement to have health coverage is not subject to criminal or civil penalties under the Code and interest does not accrue for failure to pay such assessments in a timely manner.
(h/t to Morgen Richmond at BigGovernment.)
This is probably, to echo the vice-president, a B.F.D. Without effective enforcement of the individual mandate, and with proscriptions against denying coverage on preexisting conditions, you've got yourself the potential for a pretty big moral hazard.
Pass the bill to find out what is in it. Or what ain't.
This penalty section of the bill is added to the IRS code so I wound’t be so sure that your wages couldnt be attached for amount of penalty you owe. Basically you are supposed to send in your penalty amount in or your proof of insurance
with your tax return. This can be found on page 321 line 12 through line of 24 of “The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act’’.
On line 12 they are adding a new chapter to the -Subtitle D of the Internal Revenu code of 1986 “Chapter 48-Maintenance of Minimu Essential Coverage” Sec 5000A I think if you go to the original source you can see what happens if you do not pay your fine.
What hell can we pay them, at this point the ballot box only....
The bond holders of AIG, GM, and DCC took it in a orifice that normally does not see sunlight and so will these and the Shareholders of all the Insurance Companies...
You can also redistribute wealth by destroying companies when you have dictatorial power by eliminating shareholder and other debtors value and creating new systems that even if they violate the accounting equation until the bill is due by the Chinese and the Japanese.
The question is how does he pay them, my guess our land or the intrinsic resources under all the grabbed federal land.
That's so the Democrats who don't comply can still serve in the Obama Administration. You know how they are about not paying their taxes. They gave themselves an "out."
That's true, but there must be a punitive provision in the US Code for the IRS to enforce anything. IOW, something could be illegal, but if the statute doesn't prescribe a legal consequence, their becomes no way to enforce it.
It appears that the Democrats, presumably in their haste, forgot to include the part of the law that prescribes what punitive measures the court can enforce on a guilty offender. That's a problem, legally speaking.
Folks, here how it will work.
The Treasury Department will issue regulations implementing how the Obamacare mandate penalty will be administered.
The regulations will DEEM the first part of any amounts paid as withholding or as estimated tax payments as being ALLOCATED to the health insurance penalty.
So that if there is a refund owed you, and you fail to assess yourself the penalty, they will simply deduct it from your refund.
If you owe tax after taking into account withholding and estimated tax payments, they will say that all of the tax you owe is in respect of amounts OTHER than the Obamacare penalty, because the penalty was allocated from amounts you already paid in.
So it is not all that important that they don’t have the power to go after you with a lien.
For people who don’t pay tax, Obama is not interested in going after them anyway because that is his core constituency. The same reason the government makes no meaningful attempt to go after the widespread EITC fraud - these people are Obama’s people.
Of those three, I’d say Samaritan Ministries seems to have the best reputation.
They also have a sharing model where sharing is done directly between people rather than through a centralized office. This reduces opportunity for fraud, which CHM was afflicted with some years ago. (CHM by the way replaced the fraudulent leader quite a while back).
You guys are missing it. This is INTENTIONAL. This will allow people to skip the insurance until they need it. This will in turn bankrupt the private insurance industry, which in turn will set the dems up to ride in with a single payer system.
This looks like some good campaign advertising fodder for the fall.
“So-and-so voted to take over the healthcare industry and increase the number of IRS personnel by 16% just in order to enforce the requirement that all Americans buy health insurance?”
Just guessing, but I'd imagine tthis reflects anticipation of short-term profits to be taken before everything kicks in in 4 years. AFAIK, nothing in this bill scales back any of the series of rapid rate hikes the ins companies put in place in the past couple of years in anticipation of all this. The sickest insureds are already self-culling from the regular pool, unable to manage the payments. The rest will quickly, transferring to the govt-subsidized high risk pool being set up to begin this Sept. Lower cost and higher profit for the ins. cos. for now.
The pre-existing condition mandate kicks in in 2014. The govt is playing cute with the benefits victory lap rhetoric, leading people to believe that pre-existing conditions will be covered starting now on any new or existing policy. Sleight of hand. What this bill does, if I'm not mistaken, is say it's illegal to cancel a policy if someone gets sick--which is already illegal if the insured has properly disclosed previous conditions and met waiting periods.
Given that the bill also bans insurance companies from denying coverage based on pre-existing conditions, WHY WOULD ANYONE OBTAIN INSURANCE COVERAGE PRIOR TO NEEDING IT? This was already going to be a problem with the relatively low cost of the penalty, but take away any meaningful enforcement of it and it is a complete and total joke.
Correct. And the joke goes much deeper, for instance what contractural terms are legitimate under the "Bill"?
Or what exactly is the nature of "insurance" when a third party (the government) with no involvement in the "risk" dictates premiums, penalties, and services for an assessed risk by two contracting parties?
It really really really is unbelievable that ass*** politicians passed this fiasco. And Harvard Graduates!
I’ve seen no facts from liberal Republicans or Democrats about Obamacare to date—only political class folks shouting contracting dishonest hyperbole and hysteria.
What really angers me, is that too many Republicans have shouted that anyone who isn’t rich belongs to Obama. BS. In all of their vanity, they refuse to realize as to what happened to their real political support (the votes of “arrogant” males—i.e., hard working men—and their families, even after being torn apart by the bipartisan laws of anti-family political correctness).
Here are some facts. Breckenridge and other resorts bristled with Obama signs before the election. Poorer, mostly Republican counties didn’t. Many poor folks pay their own way and actually do enough physical labor to stay in touch with reality and retain some honesty. There aren’t a whole lot of “gay” people among poor folks, BTW, except those who’ve been infected with AIDS by business leaders and subsequently dumped in poor neighborhoods.
I despise contemporary politics. Most who are involved in both political parties are fascists/commies. Most of the people receiving large incomes are receiving them from government jobs or special interests entangled with government.
This is one ugly oligarchy...or plutocracy. Our business, political and academic leaders are weird. Their families are weird and full of the strange, acute sensitivities of excesses of baseless pride. They lie, cheat and steal. They rebel against business health brought by competition. They use big government to control an unnaturally enlarged labor pool. They love the enemy more than they love their neighbors. This is not the America that I was brought up in.
Obamacare is only a symptom of a much larger problem. And chances are, single, working class people and families yet retaining fathers against the will of the rich will have to pay. Legal immigrants who’ve paid huge sums of very hard earned money to be with their American spouses will also have to pay or risk being deported.
Without moral conservatism, there will be no fiscal conservatism. The two go hand in hand, and that’s the only way that either will exist.
Nationalized medicine should be abolished, BTW. So should insurance companies.
Thank you.
I have been wondering what other Freepers knew about these organizations. I have only been posting them because they are a valid way to avoid government death care.(My new term for “health care”).
I appreciate the information.
Preposterous!? Well, the federal government is now funding abortions. My tax dollars supporting something that is total against my religion. A cradle to grave kinda thing, if you can make it out of the womb.
Seems like many people are starting to get really angry.
I'm still trying to determine what the tipping point will be...
5.56mm
No there is another possiblility and the insurance companies can drop their lines of health insurance. The GOP should make it a point of their election drive that they willnot fund any new IRS agents.
LOL. I like your plan.
What serious organizations are appealing it on Constitutional grounds? They would make very good charitable donations right now.
My doctor emailed me info on these guys a coupld days ago. It made me feel a little better that there might be something to fall back on. But I pray that it doesn’t come to that.
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