This boat, with a crew of 50, sounds significantly more automated than the previous Soviet-era boats, or even the current U.S. Virginia class.
Posted on 03/15/2010 9:08:56 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
So do they not have propellers? I believe that props may give away a little acoustic signature even with cruciform vortex dissipaters.
I mean no Gyroscope?? No bearings in the gyro?
Define very very quiet.
Information on the noise level of submarines is mostly secret.
So quiet that they’ve been undetectable by US and Russian subs.
So quiet that the Russian navy has ceased encroaching in Norwegian littoral waters.
So quiet that the US has contracted one of these subs to provide OPFOR and training.
So quiet that the US Navy has considered buying one of these subs for evaluation and littoral work.
THAT quiet.
Especially compared to a nuclear sub.
Dunno. Although I have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, I’m not an expert, even though I may play one [badly] on FR...
Russian engineering tends to be very robust.
In the first place the designers know that the people doing maintenance will be drunk, or at best badly hung over.
No one ever got fired for making something that doesn't break
And the Soviet Union measured the industrial output of everything in tons!
Diesel-electric submarines have a stealth advantage over their nuclear counterparts. Nuclear submarines generate noise from coolant pumps and turbo-machinery needed to operate the reactor, even at low power levels.
http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/ARCHIVE/2008/APRIL/Pages/AntiSub2301.aspx
“Although the Navy has the world’s most technologically advanced fleet — including state-of-the-art nuclear attack submarines — officials acknowledge that these comparatively low-tech diesel-electric boats could give an enemy an asymmetric advantage.”
Here is an enjoyable video of the top 10 DE subs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOaFtMZ0aKc
BTW, SOSUS in now an integrated part of the Integrated Undersea Surveillance System (IUSS).
But with every new innovation, there are immediately efforts to counter its effectiveness, as well as efforts to take it up to the next level.
In this case, DARPA is working on the Defense Underground Mapping Satellite Tracking and Ranging (DUMSTR) system through the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), which probably can use its LEO satellites to detect submarines; or else the Office of Naval Research (ONR) is working on a similar system for that purpose.
Just in the last month, the US has likewise begun a worldwide surface ship tracking program as well, that would easily integrate this information.
But there is already the possibility of an effective counter, using a fleet of very low power “torpedoes” that use ocean currents and temperature gradients to patrol a 3D undersea area for months. Now only used as sensor arrays, internally they are somewhat like ether “water dipping birds”, moving up and down while currents slowly push them in a direction. They could be an effective area denial weapon against submarines, and are completely passive.
Things change.
The diesel engines built for submarine use are so finely balanced that one can stand a nickel on-edge on one running at full throttle.
Add soft engine mounts and the vibrations propagated out the hull are essentially nil.
Yes, as Phishfry says there are other noise sources as well, but if you care enough to do that much engineering on a 110 year old basic engine design, you also care enough to do all you can to suppress any flow noise sources as well.
I’m given to understand that some of our subs produce less noise than an equivalent volume of ordinary sea water.
The US Navy uses the term, “look for the hole in the ocean”.
This boat, with a crew of 50, sounds significantly more automated than the previous Soviet-era boats, or even the current U.S. Virginia class.
Your knowledge of D-E submarines is outdated by about 30 years. Modern D-E submarines with AIP are STEALTHIER than advanced nuclear submarines, and the most cutting edge variants (such as the German U212/214) are the stealthiest manned attack vessels in any navy. They can stay underwater for weeks at a time, and around littoral waters are the USN's worst nightmare.
You're lucky some navy FReepers were not on this thread, otherwise you would have had some rather snarky comments. Anyways, a modern D-E submarine is in no way similar to its 1950s predecessors.
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