Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: pfflier
Go ahead, tell us why the F-35 will be superior to an F-22.

OK, for one, it will be made in superior numbers. If that's irrelevant to you, the number of Russian stealth fighters produced is irrelevant, as well.

Second, it will have multi-role capability.

Third, it will be in service with the other branches of the armed forces, operating from forward bases with STOVL and CV (carrier variant) models.

All you who short stroke it over the F-22 should remember the F-35 is produced by the same firm, Lockheed/Martin. I think they know what they're doing.

18 posted on 02/22/2010 7:43:09 PM PST by edpc (Those Lefties just ain't right)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies ]


To: edpc

I think that the 1.2 trillion “stimulus” money could have bought SIX THOUSAND F-22’s - at full price.

Do the math.

And would have saved or created, a whole bunch more (outstanding) American high tech jobs than those “shovel ready” bank bailouts accomplished.


19 posted on 02/22/2010 7:52:39 PM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (2012: Repeal it all... All of it!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies ]

To: edpc
Multi-role is not air superiority.

Large numbers of multi- role fighters are called a target rich environment by the fighter jocks. Producing F-22s in larger numbers will have an exponentially better effect on our pilots kill ratios not to mention their survivability.

Multi basing modes and multi-service use make the F-35 user friendly for spare parts. That doesn't give the F-35 superior airworthiness or survivability.

FYI I built F-16s for General Dynamics before they became Lockheed Martin. Yes they know what they are doing. Building an aircraft that their customer specifies.

20 posted on 02/22/2010 7:58:17 PM PST by pfflier
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies ]

To: edpc
All you who short stroke it over the F-22 should remember the F-35 is produced by the same firm, Lockheed/Martin. I think they know what they're doing.

I think they make what the government buys.

The F-22 is clearly superior to the F-35.

But, I believe that there is an unmanned aircraft waiting in the wings. Which can take down any manned aircraft.

22 posted on 02/22/2010 8:01:55 PM PST by CurlyDave
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies ]

To: edpc
All you who short stroke it over the F-22 should remember the F-35 is produced by the same firm, Lockheed/Martin

Actually, that is precisely the problem! Rather than championing the F-22, they can kowtow to Gates and eliminate the Raptor and get the money back in spades with the F-35 crap sandwich.

25 posted on 02/22/2010 8:04:42 PM PST by Fractal Trader
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies ]

To: edpc
OK, for one, it will be made in superior numbers. If that's irrelevant to you, the number of Russian stealth fighters produced is irrelevant, as well.

The F-22 was also meant to be produced in large numbers - almost 800 airframes. However that was cut to around 300, then further cut to 187. At the original numbers, the F-22 would cost less per unit than the F-35.

Second, it will have multi-role capability.

The F-22 is also capable of multi-role capability. In fact, it can be argued that it is BETTER than the F-35 for strike against a foe with an advanced IADS since the Raptor was meant to be a very capable IADS penetrator with its all aspect stealth as well as its high kinematic performance (unlike the F-35 whose stealthiness is most geared towards X-band and its kinematic envelop). With small-diameter bombs (which it can carry 8 internally) launched at s'cruise from high altitude, the Raptor can defeat any current IADS (including double digit SAMs) without problems.

Third, it will be in service with the other branches of the armed forces, operating from forward bases with STOVL and CV (carrier variant) models.

The F-35 is definitely needed for the Marines (due to the STOVL aspect), however one of the reasons the YF-22 was chosen over the YF-23 BlackWidow was because of the NATF function (that was thereafter cancelled) that asked for a navalised ATF. The F-22 can be navalised. Anyways, against a REAL foe (not Operation Desert Storm against the Iraqi airforce, or Operation Urgent Fury where F-15s were providing air superiority cover over Grenada, or Operation Nobel Anvil where we faced the decrepit MiG-29s of the Yuglosav airforce .....I am talking about a real foe that employs modern tactics, has modern weapons including BVR and standoff weapons, employs the use of jammers, and has battlespace awareness) like say China, it will be interesting how well the F-18s and F-35s would do. Against the 'usual' threat ...even modernized F-4 Phantoms will warmed over avionics and better weapons could MORE than suffice ...however someday the US may have to fight an opponent who comes close on a qualitative basis (a near peer).

All you who short stroke it over the F-22 should remember the F-35 is produced by the same firm, Lockheed/Martin. I think they know what they're doing.

Yes, LockMart definitely knows what it is doing. A professional firm that has delivered good equipment. However, it also knows (as does the Pentagon and Congress) that the F-35 is not as good as the F-22 due to the roles they were meant to play. The F-22 was the big dog that was supposed to be BOTH an air-dominance fighter as well as an advanced IADS penetrator, while the F-35 was supposed to come in and mop up. In that regard both are flawless. The problem happened when the Raptor when from almost 800 to only 187, and as recently as a month ago talk started coming up of how the F-35 will also replace F-15s (when originally it was supposed to replace F-16s, 18s, Harriers and A-10s). LockMart knows what it is doing ...it is a great firm ....however, Volkswaggen is also a great firm, and it owns Lamborghini and Audi. While it knows what it is doing, it would be ludicrous for it to start offering Audi A-8 (a very good luxury car) as replacement for a Lamborghini Murcielago ....when the competition will be half-way between a Ferrari F-430 and an Audi R8.

Our previous air superiority fighter, the F-15 whipped its comtemporaries.

Yes it did. It beat the Iraqi and Yugoslav airforces...in much the same way that the LA Lakers would trounce the Iraqi and Yugoslav basketball teams. To use my favorite analogy ...if Indian SU-30MKIs flew against Pakistani F-16s, the bloodbath would be just as skewed ...only this time it would be the F-16s dropping. The Indian Sukhois, backed by their Israeli sourced Phalcon AESA radar, and against the F-16As without real BVR capability (though Pakistan will soon be changing that), would be similar to a USAF F-15 backed by AESA coming up against an Iraqi Mirage without a chance in hell.

Considering we took aircraft originally designed for air combat and made them successful in other areas, I am confident we've learned a thing or two and will make a fine true multi-role fifth generation model.

There are several air-superiority fighters that have been turned into great multi-role/attack fighters ....however the opposite direction does not work.

37 posted on 02/23/2010 1:54:44 AM PST by spetznaz (Nuclear-tipped Ballistic Missiles: The Ultimate Phallic Symbol)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson