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1 posted on 08/16/2009 3:22:34 AM PDT by Scanian
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To: Scanian

2 posted on 08/16/2009 3:25:52 AM PDT by Diogenesis ("Those who go below the surface do so at their peril" - Oscar Wilde)
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To: Scanian

bullcrap. ANY federally based health plan is unconstitutional, and Republicans should know better.


3 posted on 08/16/2009 3:32:02 AM PDT by roamer_1 (It takes a (Kenyan) village to raise an idiot.)
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To: Scanian
Under the Patients' Choice Act, low-income Americans would receive vouchers for health care in the form of tax rebates to purchase health insurance: $2,300 for individuals and $5,700 for families.

It's still redistribution. Giving deadbeats something for "free" (as in 'paid for by the taxpayers') merely rewards deadbeat behavior.

Real "reform" starts with tort reform, and breaking down the state-by-state barriers that prevent competition, and putting health care choices into the hands of the individual instead of the employer.

5 posted on 08/16/2009 3:45:02 AM PDT by meyer (Do not go gentle into that good night - Rage, rage against the dying of the light.)
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To: trooprally

bookmark


11 posted on 08/16/2009 4:26:34 AM PDT by trooprally (Never Give Up - Never Give In - Remember Our Troops)
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To: Scanian

Interesting how the RATS are always most concerned with plotting our demise and rationing medical care BEFORE their bill is even passed.


12 posted on 08/16/2009 4:27:21 AM PDT by Waco (Libs exhale too much)
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To: Scanian

Feds: Here is the only plan that will work:

Get the Government Bureaucrats and the Ambulance Chasing Lawyers out of the healthcare business. Do that, and the system will take care of itself.

But of course that isn’t your real goal. You RINOS and Demonrats really want to control healthcare, and through it, control the people.


13 posted on 08/16/2009 4:33:32 AM PDT by LegendHasIt
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To: Scanian
And 47 million Americans worry what will happen to them or their children if they get sick."

Why are the Reps using the 47 million uninsured figure?

24 posted on 08/16/2009 5:56:19 AM PDT by kabar
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To: Scanian

Allow health care practitioners to write down any free care given to qualifying patients, on a sliding scale from poverty level, against their income. Buy one get one free! A doctor giving away $100,000 of time and care gets to keep $100,000 of income free of taxation. Problem solved.


27 posted on 08/16/2009 6:46:22 AM PDT by outofsalt ("If History teaches us anything it's that history rarely teaches us anything")
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To: long hard slogger; FormerACLUmember; Harrius Magnus; hocndoc; parousia; Hydroshock; skippermd; ...


Socialized Medicine aka Universal Health Care PING LIST

FReepmail me if you want to be added to or removed from this ping list.

**This is a high volume ping list! (sign of the times)**


30 posted on 08/16/2009 8:35:57 AM PDT by socialismisinsidious ( The socialist income tax system turns US citizens into beggars or quitters!)
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To: Scanian; auh20; roamer_1; rvoitier; livius

While this is miles better than ObamaCare or PelosiCare, one of the problems with these proposals is the acceptance that federal government should have a direct role (at least, financial, initially) in providing health care. It’s somewhat akin to expanding Medicare / Medicaid, and we already know the road it leads to...

Yes, the GOP should not be a “Party of ‘No’” but far better for Republicans would be to point out the failures of states like MA, TN, HI, KY implementing their own insurance reforms and schemes (single payer, coverage mandates, taxes etc.) and the utter unnecessity of federal involvement in what could be considered a state issue.

Instead of experimenting with providing money and/or insurance for health care on grand scale on national level, let each state devise their own form of financial suicide / bankruptcy. Why have “one size fits all” health care / insurance, when “progressive” states could do the one their citizens want [to pay for]?

If, as liberals say, the reforms should cover more people at lower costs and better care, wouldn’t states that implement their reforms attract more people to these states, making health care even cheaper and better, at the expense of neighboring, “conservative” or less “progressive” states? States will then have to compete with each other on cost, access, choice and quality of care, something that’s lacking right now, and people can vote with their ballots, feet and wallets. If particular states’ systems / experiments fail (and we know which will), they can change their system or their voters can change it for them.

Problem solved! GOP is no longer a “Party of ‘No’”, the debate about necessity of national (and nationalized) health care becomes immediately derailed, and all eyes turn to the failures and bankrupt policies in MA, TN etc. - something that’s close to home and that the people can relate to, instead of looking at Canadian or UK’s NHS systems they don’t know or understand.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2303225/posts?page=11#11 - The universal health care dogs that aren’t barking (The failures of MA and HI are being ignored) - FR, 2009 July 28.


31 posted on 08/16/2009 11:42:26 AM PDT by CutePuppy (If you don't ask the right questions you may not get the right answers)
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To: Scanian
Those who engage, must elevate the debate to the point where the media cannot distort it as being just "ignorance" (as Katie Couric claimed yesterday).

Edmund Burke, before the British Parliament way back in March 1775, observed the colonists' fierce "spirit of liberty." He said:

"In other countries the people . . . judge of an ill principle in government only by an actual grievance; here they anticipate the evil and judge of the pressure of the grievance by the badness of the principle." He said Americans could detect "misgovernment at a distance and sniff the approach of tyranny in every tainted breeze."

James Madison put it this way, "The freemen of America did not wait till usurped power had strengthened itself by exercise, and entangled the question in precedents. They saw all the consequences in the principle, and they avoided the consequences by denying the principle. We revere this lesson too much, soo to forget it."

Any Republicans or Democrats who "compromise" for the sake of popularity now on this important principle involving future generations should be recalled at the next election cycle!

This is not about a frivolous question of which provisions are acceptable and which are unacceptable. This is about a power struggle between the principles the founding generation were willing to stake their "lives, property, and sacred honor" for, and those who, throughout the history of civilization have arrogated unto themselves power over other people's lives.

The current "issue" called "health care reform," or its equally obnoxious semantic twin "health insurance reform," is just the invasion of liberty by arrogant elected officials which has finally aroused citizens who, heretofore, ignored the decades-long power grab by those who were supposed to protect "We, the People's" constitutional principles.

Now, citizens are seeing that it is a matter of "principle," not an issue of semantics over wording.

They should not allow their elected representatives to be coopted by "blue dogs" or any other "wolf in sheep's clothing" that would allow what may turn out to be the most important watershed moment in the history of American liberty to be further threatened. Now, Conrad and Sebelius, and others, sensing the voter mood are throwing out "compromise" talk this weekend, all to punt for better position down the road. Seize the moment for the sake of posterity and just say, "no"!

A word from the author of our Declaration of Independence regarding citizens and oppressive government might give some backbone to today's citizens:

"The most effectual means of preventing the perversion of power into tyranny are to illuminate . . . the minds of the people at large, and more especially to give them knowledge of those facts which history exhibits, that they may. . . know ambition under all its shapes, and . . . exert their natural power to defeat its purposes." - Thomas Jefferson

And, for more wisdom from the same source:

" . . . this is a tendency of all human governments. A departure from principle in one instance becomes a precedent for a second, that second for a third, and so on, till the bulk of the society is reduced to be mere automatons of misery, to have no sensibilities left but for sin and suffering. Then begins, indeed, the bellum omnium in omnia, which some philosophers. . . have mistaken it for the natural, instead of the abusive state of man. And the forehorse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follws that, and in its train wretchedness and oppression."- Thomas Jefferson

33 posted on 08/16/2009 12:10:57 PM PDT by loveliberty2
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To: Scanian
The health care system in America is broken

No, it isn't.

And by cooperating in this big lie, the Republicans are assuring 50+ years of Democrat dominance.

The counter to the Democrat plan for the destruction of the greatest health care system on earth is - no plan.

One does not plan for nonexistent contingencies.

The health care system is NOT broken - not yet.

35 posted on 08/16/2009 12:20:53 PM PDT by Jim Noble (I hope Sarah will start a 2nd party soon)
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To: Scanian
When Republicans controlled Congress and the White House, from 2003-06, they provided Health Savings Accounts

Democrats have fought HSAs tooth-and-nail from the very start. Too much individual control over their own welfare.

HR3200 eliminates HSAs, by the way...

37 posted on 08/16/2009 12:48:58 PM PDT by GVnana (Sarah for America)
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To: Scanian
Personal Responsibility needs to be increased, not decreased.

Justin Tevis Gets Radical Back in front of Lois Capps office

39 posted on 08/16/2009 2:06:00 PM PDT by Zevonismymuse
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To: Scanian

WHY THE HELL IS THIS PLAN NOT BEING TOUTED BY REPUBLICANS ?


47 posted on 08/17/2009 3:32:18 AM PDT by ballplayer
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