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To: 2Wheels
Actually, I am not American, I am just watching from the side line. While this might come from my half-assed following of US politics, I have not yet noticed a single important decision by Obama that has been passed. So while the election of a Democrat is of course be an unfortunate thing for the Conservative camp, I would reserve judgement on Obama until he actually does something significant.

The whole "he is not a US citizen" assumption strikes me as just as improbable as the assumption that the previous administration made the towers fall because they were EVIL - something like that would be impossible to keep a secret due to the number of people involved, and I just honestly doubt it would happen unless the conspirators were absolute idiots.

I don't want to question that you have a right to a proof he's a citizen - I just doubt that this line of reasoning will help the conservative agenda in the USA in any way, because as it is the case with conspiracy theories, they consist of about 50% rational people and 50%...how to put it...radical constructivists who see everything as proof for their line of reasoning and nothing as proof against it.

2,156 posted on 08/05/2009 11:01:04 AM PDT by PoliticsAndSausages
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To: PoliticsAndSausages

I appreciate your honesty and some points of validity.

Very briefly, Obama convicts himself of unprecedented deceit in view of the world populus.........with a specific goal/agenda/unforthrightness going into politics.......by his personal hiring of an entourage to maintain the deceit indefinitely!

Now - I didn’t even mention a birth certificate or citizenship in the sentence above. But you see, it is his own action - or lack thereof - that created this entire birth certificate/citizenship subject matter.

Let’s make this easy: Had he never hidden any of his documents from the world....this is all then moot, isn’t it? He would never have been eligible for these offices because HE knows he was never eligible. There is no other reason to hide a lifetime’s worth of documents.
I said there is NO REASON TO EVER HIDE A LIFETIME’S WORTH OF VITAL DOCUMENTATION!
I am not fooled. And I have never been so insulted. But he knows he will stop at nothing to maintain his deceit. If a human is willing............to plan worldwide deceit, there is nothing he will not do to maintain that deceit.
It was easy for him once he reached the Senate level. He knew then, that he was a deceiver of the US public, and he thought ‘why stop here?’.

Obama, (I hate to say this....) isn’t worried in the least about ANY of the 1000’s of posts and would be detectives on this subject. He isn’t worried about Orly Taitz or Berg or Farah or the Supreme Court, is he?
The chances of absolute documentation getting proven in any court system would be a Godsend miracle. Zero has too many levels of ‘protection’ for any legitimate document to ever reach a point to prove him to be a liar on his citizenship. Too many willing Obots willing to take the risks to protect this fool when all he is doing is driving ALL of us into the ground (even his precious supporters).

We already know without dispute - that this person is deceiving us all intentionally. Again, his entire life history is hidden. Let’s back into this by assuring you of what he is NOT hiding among all he hidden documents:
He is not hiding that he was born in Hawaii since that would not be something to hide would it. Yet, he refuses to reveal the REAL Hawaiian birth cert. and has no intention of ever doing so!
He is also not hiding factual data of ever becoming a US citizen - surely this is not something to hide. Please understand that some of us DO KNOW the COLB he and his followers pass around is NOT ANY FORM of an OFFICIAL DOCUMENT. It doesn’t even have a signature on it!

So, whatever he is hiding is likely the OPPOSITE of one or both of the above - and both lead to the same conclusion.
He is not a US citizen and proving so in his own willingness to deceive us with all his hidden documents and falsified COLB data.

Here it is. If his hidden college thesis papers and others, revealed that he supports certain causes or has a racial or religious stance....there would have been NO REASON to hide ALL the other life documentation would there.
Suppose an early document proved his father is not who Barry claims he is....that alone would not be a reason to hide ALL his valid life documentation, would it.
Go down the list of ALL the documents in hiding - and describe any of them that would turn his world upside to the point that he would think he had to hide ALL his documentation in ultimate secrecy!

Ah now we’re getting close to home. It is the combined data - the COMMON data string in all his life’s documentation that paint the picture. The common piece of information on all these hidden forms that PROVE where his citizenship lies....or better yet...where it does not lie.

By default - it proves his citizenship is not in the USA.
Surely we can all see this. There is never a reason to hide your entire existence unless it ALL convicts you of one common bit of information.
That “bit” is the biggest lie the world has ever seen (exception being the devil himself).
Hiding thesis papers? Ok I’ll give you that. Hiding school grades and classes taken? I’ll give you that. Hiding childhood school information, baptism docs, numerous applications, etc. Uh oh...why?
Hiding college admittance papers? Why? Why to all combined?
It all leads to one specific detail: Citizenship.

Now, forgive my rant. It is not directed at you - PolandSaus.
It is to all who can’t see this grim situation for what it is.

Nothing will stop him short of a radical turn around in House and Senate seats, or heaven forbid - waiting until 2012 9if the voting isn’t fixed by then), or a mass of the US population physically knocking on his WH door. Hanging out in these forums will never do the job required to put pressure on the deceiver.


2,167 posted on 08/05/2009 1:20:41 PM PDT by 2Wheels
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To: PoliticsAndSausages
For many of us, PoliticsAndSausages, citizenship has not been in question - though it would be a useful lever if any of the documents are made available to show, for example, that he registered as a foreign student at Occidental, or has an Indonesian passport. Our founders anticipated the dangers of a leader with foreign allegiances and required only of our commander in chief that he be a natural born citizen. The definition has been attacked by Obama supporters, but they can't change our history. Because Obama Senior was a British Citizen, Obama is illegitimate. That is a fact. The “natural born citizen” requirement has been challenged again and again, last in 2005 by Oren Hatch, but there have never been the votes to change it.

If the courts don't step in, the constitution is meaningless. It can be changed by obots, or by Acorn, because the people chose to be ignorant of their laws, and our representatives as well as our judicial system and military, whose sworn oaths are to protect and obey The Constitution were weak.

You may not have seen important decisions because Obama’s minions have circumvented our advise and consent protections with forty four (at last count) czars, and a few well-placed fellow travelers, such as Tim Geithner, who is the reputed author of the TARP legislation. GM, Chrysler, lots if not most banks, our energy industry, and to come, what remains of our private health care. We are in the midst of a peaceful communist takeover of our government. Passing legislation has not been necessary so far, and may not be in the future. That is the nature of pay-to-play.

I believe that was the plan. Tarp was written long before last fall, by largely government funded programs run by well organized far left nongovernmental, nonprofit groups. See money came from Soros and many others. You'll find now familiar organization names, the Pew Trust, Ford Foundation, Macarthur Foundation, which funded John Holdren and many other leftists until Theresa Kerry, using her dead husband's vast inheritance, brought him from the spawning grounds of Berkeley to Cape Cod, and the Theresa Heinz Chair at Harvard. These are old far left connections which have been planning their revolution for years. They failed with Kerry, but found a young, pigmented, completly unknown left-wing activist to defeat their handpicked choice of an opponent - McCain who, probably not coincidentally, was a sizable recipient of Soros funds.

Every one of these thousand plus page tombs which our representatives don't even pretend to read was prepared long before Obama assumed office. Our debt has quadrupled and the new administration (I know, Barney Frank is not so new) has just told foreign investors that they must obey our environmental and labor rules if they want to invest through our state-owned banks - most of them are now state-owned, whether they needed government money or not.

If Obama were provably not a citizen, that might make it easier for some to understand that he isn't a natural born citizen. Every natural born citizen is a citizen, but only a citizen born on our soil, both of whose parents were citizens is a citizen by nature, and not just by statue.

2,170 posted on 08/05/2009 3:37:56 PM PDT by Spaulding
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