Battle lines form over fate of F-22 fighter: Obama vows to veto funds

The Washington Times ^ | July 17, 2009 | Stephen Dinan

[Scanian]

The Democrat-controlled Congress is challenging President Obamas resolve to cut an Air Force fighter plane program - a move the White House calls the first major test of its efforts to curb runaway spending and slash unneeded projects.

Mr. Obama and his spending-cut allies on Capitol Hill are going head-to-head with powerful Democratic committee chairmen and lawmakers from both parties with home-state interests in building the F-22 Raptor who are trying to add money for the fighter plane over the objections of the president and the Pentagon.

"The Pentagon doesn't want this plane; the Pentagon doesn't think we need this plane," White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said. He told The Washington Times that Mr. Obama will follow through on his threat to veto any bill that restores money for the fighter, and said the White House considers this battle to be the first test of Mr. Obama's vow to begin holding the line on spending.

Those words were echoed by Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates who, in a speech Thursday, said the administration views the F-22 as a "red line."

"If we can't get this right, what on earth can we get right?" Mr. Gates said in a speech Thursday night to the Economic Club of Chicago. "It is time to draw the line on doing defense business as usual. The president has drawn that line. And that red line with regard to a veto is real."

Mr. Obama's budget froze the F-22 program at 187 planes, but lawmakers in both the House and Senate have added money back in for more.

In the House's defense spending bill, unveiled Thursday, Rep. John P. Murtha, Pennsylvania Democrat and chairman of the House's military spending subcommittee, added back $369 million for a dozen F-22s.

[Scanian]

I'm not sure what to think about this project. I'm looking forward to Freeper input.

[Pontiac]

White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said. He told The Washington Times that Mr. Obama will follow through on his threat to veto any bill that restores money for the fighter, and said the White House considers this battle to be the first test of Mr. Obama's vow to begin holding the line on spending.

The perfect tool to kill the Stimulus II bill.

Add a rider to fund the F-22.

[GeronL]

Obama is trying to send our military backwards. our economy too.

He is not on our side.

[rlmorel]

"...the first major test of its efforts to curb runaway spending and slash unneeded projects..."

I am speechless here.

These.

People.

Are.

Completely.

Insane.

[rlmorel]

Scanian, here is what to think about this:

We depend on air superiority for the success of our armed forces. For our ground troops, our ships at sea, and nearly every single thing you can relate to.

We have been spoiled, because we have had adults in charge most of the time who understood this necessity, and worked towards maintaining it. We have had air superiority in every single engagement of any kind from the end of WWII up until today.

If we do not maintain control of the skies and cede that to our next enemy, we will see American blood shed in ways we have not seen since WWII.

We won’t be able to supply and transport our troops by air. Helicopters are sitting ducks for the enemy if they control the air. We won’t even be able to medevac.

Our supply columns will be destroyed, as will our tank formations. Our ships at sea will suffer the same fate.

In the same way that nearly the entire food chain from livestock down to corn is dependent on water, military power is dependent on air power. Without it, you cannot have and project military power.

It is really that simple, and it is why we must buy more F-22s and F-35’s. But we know that isn’t going to happen, the same way we know that transiting this economic and leadership crisis unscathed isn’t going to happen.

[thecabal]

Not insane. They have a plan. Notice that the only time they "come to Jesus" about fiscal responsibility is when it regards our defense.

BTW, I love Dramatic Gopher. LOL

[NoLibZone]

"Not insane. They have a plan. Notice that the only time they "come to Jesus" about fiscal responsibility is when it regards our defense."

BINGO!

[Scanian]

Nice summation—thanks.

[wita]

Hmmmmm?

Old: F-15 441 or so aircraft in inventory
Old: F-16 1200 or so aircraft in inventory.
approximate total 1641

New: F-22 total build 187 to replace F-15
New: F-35 to replace F-16 and Navy aircraft
desired 2,400 or so. Good luck with that number.

Quote from unnamed official: The Air Force has to at least get one point across, the official said: “If you can’t support us on 381, don’t make a premature decision to close the production line, because if you close the line, you’ve forestalled any other options.”

Other folks may have more up to date info.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

Yup. Anytime a Liberal gets worried about spending, I want to check the whereabouts of my wallet.

[Wolfie]

Same when the Conservatives stop caring about spending. So it goes.

[samtheman]

Your analysis is good, but it leaves out one point. Obummer isn’t just going to shrink our air support. He’s going to shrink the forces that depend on that support. You don’t need air support if you don’t have an army.

Well, we’ll have an army. But it will be stationed at home, fighting “domestic terrorists”, like Limbaugh, Palin and their insurrectionist supporters.

You don’t need air power to fight that kind of war.

[myknowledge]

http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-NOTAM-160209-1.html

http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-NOTAM-140409-1.html

Have a good read.

[Shady]

This is treason but you know that.

[PIF]

Be careful naming the army here - it will not be today's US Army. It most likely will be the Messiah's (and I caution you to talk about Him using that appellation) Civilian National Security Force. Some will be His cult followers, but many others will be ordinary guys taking the only job available.

You see what so many are IMHO overlooking is that given His known agenda for this year, what will he do to equal these “achievements” in the following years? I'm trying to get people to think ahead here.

As you might realize, after the passage of this year's agenda, and the huge tax increases, devalued currency, inflation, and complete lack of jobs, who in their right mind would vote in the next elections for any of these clowns?

No one will vote for them and they know it. So I'm looking for a “crisis” to occur sometime next year. And that will be the excuse they need to implement the next stage of their agenda. There will be no further national elections.

[LibLieSlayer]

If hussein is against it... I AM FOR IT!

LLS

[Lucky Dog]

You have to ask a few basic questions: What are the most basic functions of government?

The Constitution of the United States of America

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. [emphasis added]

If the current government will not (notice the argument was never "can not") meet those minimum requirements what is the alternative?

... We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness... [emphasis added]

Now where does stopping the buy of new fighters at 187 and canceling any more of those new fighters intended to replace many hundreds that are 40 years old (and will be much older before any possible replacements are available) sound like it fits into your answers?

[samtheman]

There will be no further national elections.

I said that all through the primary season, when I tried to push a more electable Republican to be nominated, however "impure" he might be on this or that particular issue.

I said it 2 years ago.

I said: "The next time the rats take the WH, it will be the end of free elections in America."

That's exactly what's going to happen.

You are exactly right.

They are setting the stage by labeling all dissent as "insurrection".

And I apologize for using the word "army".

You are right, it will be a Civilian Force manned by the unemployed (which is why the Ayatollah-in-Chief WANTS massive unemployment!) and led by the pro-Ayatollah-in-Chief zealots.

We are doomed.

[myknowledge]

http://www.ajc.com/opinion/us-military-needs-the-f-22-raptor-91117.html

[blackpacific]

I think Robert Gates is the only person working in the Pentagon who wants this beautiful and lethal weapon system cancelled.