Pentagon to end F-22 production

The Hill ^ | April 6, 2009 | Roxana Tiron

[guns_for_liberty]

“We don’t need air superiority fighting the Taliban, but we might well need it against the ChiComs or other modern adversaries.”

I say forget conventional war against the Chinese—go straight for the nuclear annihilation.

[PreciousLiberty]

“What’s really simple minded is the belief that full scale war between nuclear powers could ever be conducted with some medieval-style code of honor or enlightened self-interest that would keep nuclear weapons from the battlefield.”

It would, of course, not be “full scale war”. It would be more like, um, Vietnam, where ‘enlightened self-interest’ did in fact prevent nuclear release. Unless 0bama actually succeeds in disarming us (which even he says won’t happen anytime soon), China would know that any use of nukes would be little more than suicide on a large scale.

Those who don’t know history...

[longtermmemmory]

in military succession he moved up.

I am wondering if Gates, outside of the military, is another colin powel.

[rlmorel]

That is precisely what I am concerned about.

Bloodshed when there doesn’t need to be. All we need to do is pay attention to history and act. But that isn’t going to happen.

[2CAVTrooper]

“I cannot believe they can’t get the costs below this. Wow.”

The less you make of something, the more it costs.

That’s why a Ford costs $15,000 while a Ferarri costs $500,000+.

[2CAVTrooper]

The performances they do at airshows barely scratches the surface as to what this plane can do.

[Paul Ross]

Instead of arguing about jobs (another form of earmarking IMHO), how about arguing the value of the weapon system to our military? This argument makes the F-22 seem like a make-work program, not a US military lifesaving system.

You are totally right.

But there is THIS particular Congress to consider....which doesn't give a rat's-behind about anything BUT constituent make-work.

Gates staying on only helped give Obama credibility on defense. He needs to go along with Obama, but an impeachment won't happen with THIS congress.

[Paul Ross]

The F-22 is a boondogle.

False.

It was and remains an effective state of the art stealth fighter....which can guarantee us air superiority for the next two or three decades...which has been strung out and underfunded so that every single plane is forced to be charged about twice what it would have been if it had simply been ordered for 5 or 6 hundred planes instead of the unending "research" and Clinton-dictated "redesign" into also being an attack plane (ground bombing) and then Bush's onesy-twosy orders...along with his father and Cheney having killed the Navy version.

Economies of scale are absolutely vital in considering the deployment of weapons systems. And from the get-go, the enemies of our future aviation superiority have stymied us from deploying sufficient forces. ...And not just the F-22.

Besides, you can’t fight terrorists with the F-22 - It was designed to shoot down the best and brightest Soviet fighters around. Well, they ain’t around and soon neither will be the F-22.

Wrong again.

You can't fight terrorists unless you have air superiority.

AND The Soviet union's last fighters are still being produced by Putin/Medvedev...and you can bet that these will make into theaters that will undermine our air superiority. Same as with the French and Swedish fighters

Mig-29

Su-35

Maybe the Air Force should be next on the chopping block. It would be poetic justice.

Justice? According to Red China maybe, which wants to be hegemon of the world....

Chinese Su-27

[Paul Ross]

I should point out that McCain is no friend of Lockheed/Martin ether...

Agreed.

Nor Boeing for that matter.

He was the main force pushing to throw our Air tanker billions to France's EADS...a known danger to U.S. technology integrity....constantly stealing and re-selling U.S. technical secrets...often to rogue nations.

The choice between a not-so-covert communist and McCain was truly a bad choice. Obamination however will implement his communist design come hell or high water. He will not stop until he is impeached or something more drastic.

[Paul Ross]

You have already been appropriately answered by this:

Imagine how much a car would cost if an entirely new system was developed for 183 units.

[2CAVTrooper]

The F-35 ought to be the one given the axe IMO.

The USAF version is only a marginal improvement over the F-16 it’s intended to replace.

[ConfusedSwede]

Hopefully an end to Military-Keynesianism.

[SZonian]

Tell that to the families of this aircrew.

Spirit 03, an AC-130H gunship assigned to the 16th Special Operations Squadron, was engaging ground forces of the enemy in night-time battle near the town of Kahfji and was faced with a “return to base” decision. Concerned that American Marines were still in need of aerial close air support, the crew elected to continue on, although they knew that daybreak would soon reveal their location. As morning light illuminated the aircraft, the enemy launched a surface-to-air missile which destroyed the plane and killed all 14 crew members.

And here:http://books.google.com/books?id=KgD1VyCgGAYC&pg=PA162&lpg=PA162&dq=desert+storm+close+air+support&source=bl&ots=qMwP69ZoUP&sig=l9AarzxHcHB92IYxDEznHySCxMM&hl=en&ei=VZ_bSac-j8Yyy_m9wQg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4#PPA163,M1

Page 163 “danger close”.

I think the survivors of just these two incidents might disagree with your assessment.

SZ

[2CAVTrooper]

“The F-22 has no value to our military in that case.”

They have more value than the current 30+ year old legacy fighters that are either falling out of the sky or spending more and more time as hangar queens.

[2CAVTrooper]

“So, what position in the obama administration do you assume?”

One can only guess, but I say its on his knees smooching zero’s hind quarters.

[2CAVTrooper]

I can tell you that jazusamo is NOT a liberal, and Pres__ent with no ID Zero isn’t his “man”.

[Cheetahcat]

“Congress could keep the F22 production line alive by putting it in next years defense bill. It’s has been done many times before when an administration wanted to kill weapon systems.”

Congress ?? We have a Rat congress thanks to Bush, McQueeg and Kennedy Remember The Amnesty bill?

[Cheetahcat]

“Imagine how much a car would cost if an entirely new system was developed for 183 units.”

True but there were 800 {lanes originally But the hefty Union presence also makes things cost twice as much on the labor side.

[Cheetahcat]

Nice Post Thanks.

[sam_paine]

You cut out the rest of my statement.

IF Obama refuses to use them, then they are all hanger queens. F15s and F22s alike.