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To: demshateGod
"More of a philosophy that people, and the government, should mind their own business."

That’s not really what Liberaltarians are driven by.

This is the typical confusion about liberalism and libertarianism that we see today. It isn't surprising given how many people on TV seem to be lost about it. Bill Maher, for instance, loves to go around calling himself a libertarian while screaming support for gun control and socialism just because he likes drugs and hookers. Being immoral does not make one a libertarian.

Liberals, of course, desire state control in all aspects of life. They desire homosexual marriage in order to further a vision they have of modern culture. They would grow culture to fit their design, and that design is defined first of all by a devaluing of the Judeo-Christian systems of morality. It is all about state control to create societal change.

This is not libertarianism, though just what is can often be confusing. First there is a party that uses that name, and some think the platform of that organization reflects the de fide definition of that movement. Not so at all. Libertarianism is a basic principle or philosophy about the government and its role. Just how far one goes is open to the adherent. Many, many people are libertarian without engaging in extremist positions, just as is true on the right. Not all so-called conservatives are John Birchers or such. And not all libertarians are anarcho-capitalists. As a matter of fact, most aren't. William F. Buckley called himself a libertarian, and understood that this simply meant that he believed in limited government and individual liberty. And he was generally libertarian.

I am also libertarian, but I don't carry things as far as some will. Like many I am pro-life. Some aren't. I am not pro-gay marriage, at least with the current system, but many are. There are wide ranges of thought, but it all comes down to the limits of government and the purpose of the same.

And of course libertarianism is a key component of conservative thought. Limits on government, personal responsibility and liberty, laissez-faire economics; these are all libertarianism. Without them conservatism is left only with its traditional morality which when combined with non-libertarian views of government quickly becomes just another form of totalitarianism. What exactly would conservatism be without its libertarian foundation?

17 posted on 03/03/2009 11:38:14 AM PST by cothrige (Ego vero Evangelio non crederem, ni si me catholicae Ecclesiae commoveret auctoritas.)
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To: cothrige
What exactly would conservatism be without its libertarian foundation?

Much better off. Libertarianism leads to devolution of society.

“We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government, far from it.

We’ve staked the future of all our political institutions upon our capacity…to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God.”

[1778 to the General Assembly of the State of Virginia]
James Madison


18 posted on 03/03/2009 11:44:02 AM PST by itsahoot (We will have world government. Whether by conquest or consent. Looks like that question is answered)
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To: cothrige

The federal government should have no role in making drugs legal or illegal. That should be left to the states, for the most part. Same with prostitution, gambling, etc. The Liberaltarians I run across on FR want the federal government to legalize those things then put their stamp of approval on it by taxing it, thus protecting it and creating more bureaucracy in order to regulate it.

Most of them that I’ve come across are basically Rand disciples who believe individuality is the greatest good for society.

Where I differ is I don’t think the first step to liberty is for the feds to legalize every vice and start regulating it. That’s what I hear over and over again on FR. Let’s strip the feds of 99.833% of its power, give the States their power back, then let’s talk about whether or not we want pot legal in our respective states.

No Libertarians have ever agreed with me on that schedule but continue their mantra. That’s why I say their top priority is breaking society of its morals and blue laws so free thinking Randianism can prevail.


23 posted on 03/03/2009 11:57:01 AM PST by demshateGod (The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.)
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To: cothrige
Without them conservatism is left only with its traditional morality which when combined with non-libertarian views of government quickly becomes just another form of totalitarianism.

Excellent line.

148 posted on 03/07/2009 7:00:14 AM PST by TankerKC (It's July, 1956.)
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