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To: TigersEye; mlo
You're lying. It says you have to have a "Certificate of Live Birth because a Certification of Live Birth requires further verification." You dishonestly changed 'Certification' with 'Certificate.'

It's par for the course for him. I showed mlo the words of two Senators who wrote the 14th Amendment specifically the words "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" meant. He contradicted the meaning of what the those two Senators said in plain language.

373 posted on 02/11/2009 7:02:33 PM PST by Red Steel
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To: Red Steel

I can see that. At least there’s no need to waste effort with someone who shoots their own credibility in the foot so easily.


378 posted on 02/11/2009 7:20:47 PM PST by TigersEye (This is the age of the death of reason.)
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To: Red Steel
It's par for the course for him. I showed mlo the words of two Senators who wrote the 14th Amendment specifically the words "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" meant. He contradicted the meaning of what the those two Senators said in plain language.

Explain to me why Howard, who actually wrote the citizenship clause, had absolutely no objection (nor did any other Senator) to this understanding of the citizenship clause as related by Senator Conness:

The proposition before us, I will say, Mr. President, relates simply in that respect to the children begotten of Chinese immigrants in California, and it is proposed to declare that they shall be citizens. We have declared that by law; now it is proposed to incorporate the same provision in the fundamental instrument of the nation. I am in favor of doing so.


Clearly it is stated here that children born to non-citizen Chinese immigrants are considered to be subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and therefore citizens of the United States by birth.

Senator Howard spoke immediately after Senator Conness. Howard offered no objection whatsoever. Nor, again, did any other Senator.


387 posted on 02/11/2009 8:01:19 PM PST by Michael Michael
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To: Red Steel
"I showed mlo the words of two Senators who wrote the 14th Amendment specifically the words "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" meant. He contradicted the meaning of what the those two Senators said in plain language."

Well I wonder why. Probably because I can show you a mess of legal opinion that explains what "under the jurisdiction" means. Including rulings from the Supreme Court. But hey, ignore all that. You found a speech from a Senator. What's the law next to that?

You are picking out fragments from any text you can find that you think supports the opinion you already want to believe. It is not what the law is.

420 posted on 02/11/2009 10:39:55 PM PST by mlo
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