Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: GodGunsGuts
“But even if they did mean the same thing with respect to creation, then they may have been used as a language convention to avoid word redundancy (or both). In either case (or both), a straightforward reading of Genesis is not hindered in the least.”

Even if? I think I've provided adequate indication that the two words, bara’ and ‘asah, did NOT mean the same thing, or have you come around?

To argue for a possible language convention to explain a possible goal of avoiding word redundancy (something that would require an explanation of why the writer might want to do this) is stretching, yes.

“I think you missed my point. I said they are likely referential synonyms. That is, if both were happening on any given creation day, then either could be used to refer to the same. Not that they mean the EXACT same thing.”

Nearly so?

“That makes them referential synonyms (meaning the same thing, or nearly the same thing) in my book.”

Let's see if I do miss your point: If both (bara’ and ‘asah) were happening on any creative day then either (bara’ or ‘asah) could be used to refer to the same (same what? Could either word refer to create as well as make?)

Not that they mean the exact same thing.

As I've shown, bara’ is highly restricted in it's use so it not only doesn't mean the EXACT same thing as ‘asah, it cannot nor can the two Hebrew words be interchanged as though they were close enough in meaning as the lexicons I referenced show.

To sum up: By understanding bara’ (create) as close enough to ‘asah (make) to allow either to refer to the same act a straightforward reading of Genesis is not hindered.

On that I beg to differ as light (Day) and dark (Night) would come into existence before the sun and moon, that is unless there is another light source for the light (Day). What would that source be?

475 posted on 02/06/2009 5:21:51 PM PST by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 466 | View Replies ]


To: count-your-change; GourmetDan

==Even if? I think I’ve provided adequate indication that the two words, bara’ and ‘asah, did NOT mean the same thing, or have you come around?

There is no reason for me to come around, since I never closed-off the possibility that they have different definitions with respect to creation week. Although, GourmetDan’s point with respect to asah preceding bara in Gen. 1:26 strengthens the argument that they can both be used as standard synonyms —and/or— referrential synonyms.

==Let’s see if I do miss your point: If both (bara’ and ‘asah) were happening on any creative day then either (bara’ or ‘asah) could be used to refer to the same (same what?

Still not sure if you fully understand what I’m trying to say. My point is that since the Bible tells us that both happened on a given creation day, then either can be used to refer to said day. So even if we accept that asah and bara have different meanings, either can be used as referential synonyms to refer to a creation day where they both occured. For instance, if I went on a holiday that both involved water skiing and fishing, I could use either word to refer to the same holiday. As such, the use of asah and bara in reference to any given creation day in no way hinders a straigtforward reading of creation week where “evening and morning” are used in conjunction with an ordinal number attached to a specific day/yom. This language is a direct appeal to our own experience with respect to what is meant by “day”, where each day is defined by an ordinal number and “evening and morning.” To my mind, it is those who try to read-in long ages who are engaged in all the twisting and stretching.

==To argue for a possible language convention to explain a possible goal of avoiding word redundancy (something that would require an explanation of why the writer might want to do this) is stretching, yes.

I did some checking and discovered I am not alone in my understanding of how asah and bara are used with respect to creation week in Genesis. Although, I must admit others have communicated the idea much better than my feeble attempts to describe the same. As it turns out, what I was driving at is known as “Synonymous Parallelism.” To wit:

“A synonymous parallelism is where a thought is stated in one phrase and then repeated in different words in the next phrase. The following synonymous parallelisms show the equivalent meanings of bara and asah.

Genesis 2:4 This is the history of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens.

Exodus 34:10 And He said: “Behold, I make a covenant. Before all your people I will do (asah) marvels such as have not been done (bara) in all the earth, nor in any nation; and all the people among whom you are shall see the work of the LORD. For it is an awesome thing that I will do (asah) with you.

Isaiah 41:20 That they may see and know, And consider and understand together, That the hand of the LORD has done (asah) this, And the Holy One of Israel has created (bara) it.

Isaiah 43:7 Everyone who is called by My name, Whom I have created for My glory; I have formed him, yes, I have made him.”

Notice that these examples strengthen GourmetDan’s argument that these words can be used as standard synonyms (not just referrential synonyms). I don’t pretend to have all the answers, but one thing is clear—neither asah or bara in any way hinders a straightforward reading of the biblical account of creation week in Genesis.


479 posted on 02/07/2009 11:10:42 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 475 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson