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To: Para-Ord.45
Let`s see what Abe meant later...

Lincoln was a man of his times. If his views towards blacks were so contemptable then please show me where the Southern leaders were so much better? If you want to hold Lincoln to a certain standard then shouldn't you hold his peers to the same standard? So how about it? Any quotes from Davis showing he thought blacks were his equal in any way whatsoever? Any from Lee? Jackson? Anyone?

You can call his ideas of repatriation BS all you wish, it won`t make reality disappear.

Nor will it turn your falsehood into fact. Lincoln was in favor of voluntary colonization. Big deal, many people in the U.S. were in favor of it. But the key word is voluntary, not the mass deportation of each and every one that you claimed in your earlier message. And when you get right down to it, please tell me where Lincoln was so wrong? What was the alternative? Slavery? That's what the South wanted. And where slavery was outlawed what were the conditions? Did the average white person welcome freed blacks? No. Did they have the same opportunities as whites? No. Was there discrimination and racism? Most certainly yes. Lincoln wasn't any fool. He knew what the average American was like and knew what reception lay in store for freed slaves. He also was smart enough to know that he wasn't going to change most people's minds. So why not emigrate? Why not offer them a chance to return to Africa and carve out a life for themselves, free from the racism and hatred that they faced in the U.S.? I'm not saying Lincoln's idea was the best one going, but I understand why he offered it and I'm damned if I can see why he was such a rotten person as a result. Madison supported colonization. Monroe did. Breckenridge did. Lee put his money where his mouth was and paid passage for some of his slaves to Liberia. Again, if Lincoln is such an evil individual for supporting voluntary colonization then weren't all those other men as well?

The Proclamation was nothing more than war propaganda to encourage discontent among slaves in the Confederacy.

And that call in the Proclamation? The one that said, "And I hereby enjoin upon the people so declared to be free to abstain from all violence, unless in necessary self-defence; and I recommend to them that, in all cases when allowed, they labor faithfully for reasonable wages?" I suppose Lincoln put that in to throw people off from the real reason for the proclamation - to kill all de white men and rape all de white wimmin? I swear you Southron types are shameless.

The fuel that fired secessionists were the Tariff of 1828, Morrill tariff,etc.

Oh barf. The fuel that fired the secessionists was what they saw as a threat to their institution of slavery. Pure and simple.

52 posted on 12/24/2008 2:26:34 PM PST by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur

From Lincoln’s Second Inaugural Address:
“One-eighth of the whole population were colored slaves, not distributed generally over the Union, but localized in the southern part of it. These slaves constituted a peculiar and powerful interest. All knew that this interest was somehow the cause of the war. To strengthen, perpetuate, and extend this interest was the object for which the insurgents would rend the Union even by war, while the Government claimed no right to do more than to restrict the territorial enlargement of it. Neither party expected for the war the magnitude or the duration which it has already attained. Neither anticipated that the cause of the conflict might cease with or even before the conflict itself should cease. Each looked for an easier triumph, and a result less fundamental and astounding. Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God’s assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men’s faces, but let us judge not, that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered. That of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes. “Woe unto the world because of offenses; for it must needs be that offenses come, but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh.” If we shall suppose that American slavery is one of those offenses which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South this terrible war as the woe due to those by whom the offense came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a living God always ascribe to Him? Fondly do we hope, fervently do we pray, that this mighty scourge of war may speedily pass away. Yet, if God wills that it continue until all the wealth piled by the bondsman’s two hundred and fifty years of unrequited toil shall be sunk, and until every drop of blood drawn with the lash shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said “the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.”
With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation’s wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.”—March 4, 1865


53 posted on 12/24/2008 3:45:20 PM PST by jamese777
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To: Non-Sequitur

” Lincoln was a man of his times “

So why isn`t he portrayed as such by historical revisionists? Lincoln believed blacks were an inferior race. Not the story being told today.

” Lincoln was in favor of voluntary colonization. Big deal...Was there discrimination and racism? Most certainly yes. Lincoln wasn’t any fool...”

Fool no, racist yes. Once more, unbeknownst to most who are told of Lincoln and do not read for themselves is that he was a white supremacist not some morally superior super human ahead of his time.

” And that call in the Proclamation.I suppose Lincoln put that in to throw people off from the real reason for the proclamation - to kill all de white men and rape all de white wimmin? I swear you Southron types are shameless.”

You`re so naive it`s almost laughable.September 13, 1862 the day after, Lincoln said, “ Understand, I raise no objections against it [slavery] on legal or constitutional grounds ... I view the matter [emancipation] as a practical war measure, to be decided upon according to the advantages or disadvantages it may offer to the suppression of the rebellion.”

Lincoln responding to an op-ed piece in the then NY Tribune,who called on Lincoln to immediately and totally abolish slavery,

” My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that. “

Once again, Lincoln signed the proclamation as nothing more than war propaganda.

” The fuel that fired the secessionists was what they saw as a threat to their institution of slavery.”

Slavery was going to die a slow death being economically untenable. If Abe was truly the Messiah of his day then he would have abolished slavery through a scheme of compensated emancipation, end it peacefully, without war. The fact is slavery was irrelevant, tariffs were.

Lincoln ignored the right to secession, ignored the 10nth Amendment, ignored habeas corpus, committed war crimes by sacking and burning whole southern cities.

And you,you`re just another typical revisionist-apologist.


54 posted on 12/24/2008 3:51:30 PM PST by Para-Ord.45
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