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To: ckilmer
The one that the Hawaii Department of Health officials made public last June was an electronic copy of the certificate.

Which one was this? Certainly not the one on Kos. Is this the one that BO posted on his site, but wouldn't let anyone actually see, touch, and feel? Or was that the same one Kos posted?

I just don't remember seeing anything purportedly released by Hawaiian officials. I only remember a statement that said, (paraphrasing) "it's in the vault; we've seen it; we can't by law tell you what it says, let alone give you a peek. Now go away, and leave us alone."

43 posted on 12/01/2008 12:57:39 AM PST by ApplegateRanch (The mob got President Barabbas; America got shafted)
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To: ApplegateRanch
I just don't remember seeing anything purportedly released by Hawaiian officials. I only remember a statement that said, (paraphrasing) "it's in the vault; we've seen it; we can't by law tell you what it says, let alone give you a peek. Now go away, and leave us alone."

Correct.

Excerpt from:

Obama's "birth certificate" - the devil's in the details

... snip ...

Recent Statements Regarding Obama's "Birth Certificate"

Knowing the intricacies of the Hawaiian “birth certificate” adds mystery instead of resolution with Obama birth record critics, especially when applied to statements provided by Hawaiian officials before the Presidential election.

On Oct. 31, after being inundated by requests for more details about Obama’s birth records, Department of Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said she and registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, had personally verified that the Health Department possesses Obama's original birth certificate.

"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures," Fukino said.

The cryptic and carefully-worded statement offered no true details of the “birth certificate,” and leads to more questions than answers among critics. In July, when Barack Obama’s Certification of Live Birth” was first distributed to the public, Hawaiian Department of Health spokeswoman Janice Okubo simply asserted to the St. Petersburg Times, “it’s a valid Hawaii state birth certificate.”

Although officials are on record that there is an original “birth certificate” held by the state, and that it is correctly filed according to Hawaii state directives. However, the specifics of the type of “birth certificate” records on file, with modifications, as well as the details and accounts of witnesses, is still unknown at this time.

Credibility of the " Certification of Live Birth"

The computer-generated “Certification of Live Birth” was first used in November 2001 to allow the State of Hawaii to pull up birth records quicker for people requesting a “birth certificate” in person. At the very bottom of the form are the words, “This copy serves as prima facia evidence of the fact of birth in any court proceeding.” [HRS 338-13(b), 338-19]."

However, despite this written notice on the form, some Hawaii state agencies do not accept the “Certification of Live Birth” as irrefutable verification of Hawaiian birth. There have been numerous cases when the Hawaii Family Court System required more detailed data for paternity suits. Additionally, the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands provides the following guidelines to Hawaiian natives applying for Hawaiian Home Lands homestead:

The primary documents used to show you are of age and a qualified native Hawaiian are:
- A certified copy of Certificate of Birth;
- A certified copy of Certificate of Hawaiian Birth, including testimonies; or
- A certified copy of Certificate of Delayed Birth.

“In order to process your application, DHHL utilizes information that is found only on the original Certificate, which is either black or green. This is a more complete record of your birth than the Certification of Live Birth (a computer-generated printout). Submitting the original Certificate will save you time and money since the computer-generated Certification requires additional verification by DHHL.” (emphasis added)

Additionally, the “Certification of Live Birth” is not recognized by many Federal agencies. DoD 5220.22-M, the "National Industrial Security Program Operating Manual," provides baseline standards for the protection of classified information released or disclosed to industry. Section 2-208 states that acceptable certificates must show that the birth record was filed shortly after birth. If a “Delayed Birth Certificate” is on file, it must be supported by secondary evidence of birth, such as baptismal or circumcision certificates, hospital birth records, or affidavits of persons having personal knowledge about the facts of birth.

Even to work at the Navy Ship Yard in Pearl Harbor, the August 2008 version of the, “Unified Facilities Guide Specifications,” section 1.5.22.2 allows for a total of 18 different means to verify US citizenship, ranging from a military ID card to even a “Hawaii certificate of foreign birth.” The “Certification of Live Birth” is not on the list of approved documents acceptable for proof of Citizenship.


44 posted on 12/01/2008 1:10:05 AM PST by BP2 (I think, therefore I'm a conservative)
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