Posted on 10/25/2008 11:54:53 AM PDT by grumpa
Please note this short video interview with Joe Biden. The key question the interviewer asks is whether Barack Obama is a Marxist with his spread the wealth idea--an idea that Biden embraces. Apparently the interview so infuriated Biden that he cancelled another interview on this program:
http://www.wftv.com/video/17790025/index.html
The interviewer quotes Karl Marx, comparing Marx’s views to BO and Joe Biden’s views. Here is a link to the quote she uses along with other info about Karl Marx:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_each_according_to_his_ability_to_each_according_to_his_need
There is plenty of evidence that Barack Obama has Marxist ideas. Jerome Corsi details in his book OBAMANATION a life-long series of Marxist associations Obama has had and continues to have. It is clear that Jeremiah Wright and William Ayers preach Marxist ideas. Wright’s Marxist ideas are cloaked in “black liberation theology,” which when understood is white hatred and class envy. Remember, Obama was a member of Wright’s church for 20 years, and only disavowed Wright when forced into a corner. In the case of Ayers, he preaches blatant Marxism and revolution. Obama’s claim that Ayers was just a guy in the neighborhood is an outright lie. It is now clear that Obama and Ayers had years of close association, even sharing an office together for 3 years. They made multimillion dollar decisions together on distributing funds from the various groups on which they shared board membership. There is even now evidence that Ayers helped ghost write one of Obama’s books, or at least Obama uses much of Ayers own language in the book.
But there is much more.
Obama in his book DREAMS FROM MY FATHER, Obama admits attending “socialist conferences” and coming into contact with Marxist literature. He mentions a man named “Frank” in his book as someone who shaped his ideas. This man is Frank Marshall Davis, a member of the Communist Party USA. The record shows that Obama was in Hawaii from 1971-1979, where he developed a close relationship, almost like a son, with Davis—getting advice and listening to his “poetry” and getting advice on his career path.
As a community organizer, Obama also has other far left associations. It was in Chicago that Obama maintained close ties to European socialist groups and parties through the Socialist International, and two former members of the Students for a Democratic Society (SDS), William Ayers and Carl Davidson. Davidson is now a figure in the Committees of Correspondence for Democracy and Socialism (CCDS), and offshoot of the old Moscow-controlled CPUSA.
The evidence points to BO’s “spreading the wealth” idea as being the tip of the ice berg. We already know that in just one year in the Senate BO was voted the single most liberal member of the Senate. This is not just a label. Barack Obama will take this country as far left as he possibly can. He is the most dangerous politician to hit the national stage in our country’s history. We must not underestimate the danger this man represents to the American way of life.
For more information, see my blog link below. You can also find several revealing articles on the web with a search “Obama and Marxist.”
Regards, Charles Meek
http://offgridblogger.wordpress.com/
No his voters are ill informed, but I might add some are Marxist! Obama is one! So is Pelosi, Frank, Kennedy, Waters, Schumer, Hillary, Wright, Ayers, and Sanders!
I really wonder if they are ill informed. I do not think so. I think they like socialism.
Pope Catholic?
But there's more.
In the event of widespread disaffection and upheaval (inevitable, perhaps?) the Obamanistas will, of necessity, have to find a suitable scapegoat.
Now, the scapegoating of Jews is a tried and true bromide for would-be despots, so that will likely be invoked. Wouldn't surprise me in the least.
But their number is not sufficient to justify the pogrom that will be sought.
So what they'll introduce, what with the persuasive powers of our never-at-fault mass media, is the phenomenon of Right-Wing, or Conservative, Excess!
Yes, we will be portrayed as this country's, this time's, this situation's equivalent of Russia's Kulaks, whose numbers and ineffectiveness (in responding to the threat to them) served V.I. Lenin very, very well.
The only fly in that ointment is, we have most of the guns in this country, always a problem to those who seek to suppress, and oppress, those who oppose them.
So, very early in any Obama administration that might be forthcoming, look for one of the very first acts of the new Congress to be confiscation, in some form, at least, of personally owned firearms.
Things would be a lot easier after that, huh?
After that, watch things go to Hell very rapidly.
Or, maybe I'm just feeling bummed out today.
Whatever....
CA....
Maybe, but most have never experienced socialism!
But they think it is FAIR. They want security more than anything else. Remember the last ones to admit a Ponzi scheme are the victims of a Ponzi schem. Socialism is a giant PONZI!
Compiled from my own research and that of Freeper Savvyguy’s Oct. 12, 12008 post entitled, “Time line of Barak Hussein Obama’s involvement with radical groups & friends”
www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2104516/posts
1975-1987 Frank Wallace Davis, Communist Party USA, Hawaii
Obama’s personal mentor (father figure)
1979-1981 Professor Roger Boesche, Occidental Los Angeles
Obama’s intellectual political mentor
Obama’s first public speech was at Occidental, sponsored by the Students for Economic Democracy, a branch of the Campaign for Economic Democracy, chaired by Radical Tom Hayden. In “Dreams from My Father: Obama wrote of his two years at Occidental College, “I chose my friends carefully. The more politically active black students. The foreign students. The Chicanos. The Marxist professors and structural feminists and punk rock performance poets.”
1981-1983 Zbigniew Brzezinski, Columbia Univ. New York
Obama’s “guru and controller” while at Columbia.
Former National Security Advisor (under Pres. Carter)
Brzezinski is currently Obama’s foreign policy advisor.
At Columbia: Both Obama and Ayers admit to attending anti-American rallies took place at Columbia in the early 1980s. Ayers was studying for his M.Ed in Early Childhood Education at Bank Street College (NYC) and Obama was completing his B.A. in Political Science at Columbia.
In “Dreams From My Father”, Obama reveals that while at Columbia he “went to socialist conferences …in Brooklyn.”
“Then, after transferring to Columbia University two years later, he [Obama] found that “political discussions, the kind that at Occidental had once seemed so intense and purposeful,” took on the flavor of the “socialist conferences” he sometimes attended at New York’s [Columbia’s] Coopers Union.”
1984 Obama works for three months as a community organizer for the New York Public Interest Research Group (NYPIRG), a Ralph Nader offshoot trying “to mobilize minority students at City College of New York about the importance of recycling” at City College of New York in Harlem, a school famous for hatching four Marxist professors (Irving Kristol, Nathan Glazer, Daniel Bell and Irving Howe) who owned or published leftist magazines like “The New Leader”, “Commentary”, “Dissent”, and “The Public Interest”.
1985 Obama is a consultant and instructor for the Gamaliel Foundation in Chicago, an organizing institute working throughout the Midwest.
In 1985, Gerald (Jerry) Kellman at Calumet Community Religious Conference in Chicago receives a grant from Bill Ayers at the Woods Fund, a Chicago foundation that gives grants for community organizing, to hire a new community organizer for the organization he heads called the Developing Communities Project (DCP). Later, Ayers and Obama are both on the board of the Woods Fund.
1985-1988 Obama is hired by Gerald Kellman (due to a grant from Ayers at the Woods Foundation) to be the director of the Developing Communities Project (DCP), a leftist Alinskyite community organizing subsidiary of the Gamaliel Foundation in Chicago which has Marxist Professor and former ACLU Director John L. McKnight as board director.
Professor Mckight mentored Obama while he was at DCP in the the agitation tactics of Alinsky, who wrote the organizing manual, “Rules for Radicals,” which he dedicated to mankind’s “very first radical, Lucifer.” Under McKnight, Obama says he got the “best education I ever had, better than anything I got at Harvard Law School.” (remark in 2007 while campaigning in Iowa). “My views are not so much more refined than they were when I labored in obscurity as a community organizer,” Obama wrote in his 2006 autobiography.
Fall of 1987 Bill Ayers links back up with Obama when they are “working” the same side of the 1987 Teacher’s Union Strike and both attend a Tom Ayers’ Chicago United “lunch meeting in a Chicago skyscraper”.
1987 Bill Ayers solicits Khalid Abdullah Tariq al-Mansour (a.k.a. Donald Warden) to raise money for Obama’s Harvard Law School education. al-Mansour is an orthodox Muslim, a black nationalist, an outspoken enemy of Israel, and mentor to Black Panther Party founder Huey Newton and his cohort, Bobby Seale. At the time al-Mansour associate Percy Sutton was raising money for Obama’s education, al-Mansour was the top financial advisor to mega-billionaire Prince Alwaleed bin Talal of the Saudi royal family.
1988 The ABCs Coalition is formed and is coordinated by Bill Ayers. Tom Ayers is a key member of ABC. Another member of ABCs was Obama’s Developing Communities Project.
1988 Obama joins racist, America hating Rev. Jeremiah Wright’s Trinity Church of Christ in Chicago and one Sunday was brought to tears by Rev. Wright’s “Audacity of Hope” sermon. Wright admittedly became his mentor and spiritual advisor for the next 20 years.
1988 Obama writes an essay entitled, “Why Organize? Problems and Promise in the Inner City”. It is published in the August/ September 1988 edition of Illinois Issues which was published by Sangamon State University [now the University of Illinois at Springfield]. In ths essay Obama lays out his plan to politically organize “liberationist” black churches. He saw the black church as a slumbering giant in cities like Chicago.
1988-1991 Obama goes to Harvard Law School. Whenever Obama’s in Chicago “to visit Michelle”, he takes advanced training at the Industrial Areas Foundation in Chicago, a group founded by Alinsky.
1989 Tom Ayers (father to Bill Ayers) gets Obama a summer intern position at the law firm of Sidley & Austin LLP where he is introduced to Michelle Robinson by Ayers’ wife Bernardine Dohrn who Tom Ayers also got a job there for.
1991 Obama graduates from Harvard, is named as head of the Harvard Review and takes Michelle Robinson home to Kenya to meet Obama’s family.
1992 Obama heads Project Vote-Illinois, a subsidiary of ACORN. Afterward, head of ACORN-Chicago, Madeleine Talbot, askes for Obama to train all her lead community organizers in his Alinsky style agitation tactics.
1992 Obama “blurb’s” Bill Ayers new book and
1992 The far-leftist New Party was founded, a Marxist political coalition whose objective was to endorse and elect leftist officials, mostly Democrats. They want to move the Democratic Party leftward..
1993-2004 Obama works as an associate in the Chicago Law firm of Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. In time, this job would bring him support from slum landlords like convicted felon Tony Rezco.
1993-2002 Obama seves as the Director of the Woods Fund in Chicago and grants housands and thousands of dollars to Bill Ayers, John Ayers, Mike Klonsky, ACORN, and Rev. Wright’s Trinity Church. Bill Ayers serves with Obama on the Board of the Woods Fund from 1999-2002.
1994-2002 Obama serves as the Director of the Board of the Joyce Foundation in Chicago, a position he receives due to Bill Ayers. In his tenure there, Obama grants thousands and thousands of dollars to Ayers’ radical education reform projects.
In 1995, Anne Hallett of the Cross City Campaign for Urban School Reform, Bill Ayers of the University of Illinois at Chicago, and Warren Chapman of the Joyce Foundation proposed the Chicago Annenberg Challenge.
In 1995, Ayers gives an interview in which he characterizes his political beliefs at that time and in the 1960s and 1970s: “I am a radical, Leftist, small ‘c’ communist ... [Laughs] Maybe I’m the last communist who is willing to admit it. [Laughs] We have always been small ‘c’ communists in the sense that we were never in the [Communist] party and never Stalinists. The ethics of Communism still appeal to me. I don’t like Lenin as much as the early Marx.
1995 Obama publishes “Dreams from My Father” after getting editorial help from Bill Ayers.
1995-1999 Obama serves as the Chairman of Chicago Annenberg Challenge (CAC), a position he receives due to Bill Ayers.
1995-2000, Ayers serves as Co-chair of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge’s Chicago School Reform Collaborative (CSRC), a second operating entity of the CAC.
1995-2000, Ayers serves as Co-chair of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge’s Consortium of Chicago Schools Research (CCSR), a third operating entity of the CAC.
1995-2002 through foundations Obama directs, Bill Ayers receives nearly 49 million dollars to fuel his sociopolitically destructive radical school reform projects.
1995 Obama, along with Rev. Wright and Michael Pfleger help to organize Louis Farrakhan’s famous Million Man March in DC. It is evident that the black liberationist preachers are also Obama’s valued political allies.
1995 Obama sues on behalf of ACORN for the implementation of the Motor Voter law in Illinois. ACORN later invited Obama to help train its staff on how to shake down banks.
1995 Obama seeks the New Party’s (socialistic) endorsement for his 1996 Illinois state senate run. Democratic Socialists of America founded the “New Party”. Obama got the support and uses New Party volunteers as campaign workers. The New Party rigorously evaluated its candidate endorsements & Obama HAD to sign a contract that he agrees with its goals! The NP contract mandates that anyone they rndorse must have a visible and active relationship them.
1995 New Party members who endorse Obama include Mike Klonsky, Susan Konsky, Kay Lenz, and John Ayers.
1995 Ayers & Dohrn host a coffee fundraiser for Obama’s political debut in their home.
1996-2004 Obama serves in the Illinois senate.
1997 Obama “blurbs” Bill Ayers book on juvenile crime entitled, “A Kind and Just Parent” and Obama, Ayers & Dohrn host a panel discussion over youth and the criminal justice system that is organized by Michelle Obama who is now a Dean at the University Illinois in Chicago.
1999-2002 Bill Ayers serves with Obama on the board of the Woods Fund.
1999-2001 Obama serves on the Board of Directors for CAC.
After CAC closes down, Obama serves on a successor group called the Leadership Council of the Chicago Public [Schools] Education Fund (CPED). John Ayers and Tom Ayers also serve with Obama. Bill Ayers boasts of his terrorist acts in The New York Times, USA Today, the Chicago Tribune and the Chicago Sun-Times.
1996 Bill Ayers contributes money to Obama’s campaign.
1997-Ayers published his radical book, A Kind and Just Parent, in which he brags of his terrorist acts
Dec 97, Obama wrote a positive review of Ayers’s book in the Chicago Tribune the following month. He did not know Ayer’s past?
1997- another joint appearance with Ayer
1988- In his “Why Organize?” essay, Obama planned to politically organize “liberationist” black churches. He saw the black church as a slumbering giant in cities like Chicago.
1990’s-Obama was a card carrying documented active member, participant and a direct political beneficiary of the Chicago New Party and, importantly, the Chicago Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). Newsletter said Obama “walked the walk & talked the talk” ( Newsletter , New Ground 45, March-April , 96.)
Democratic Socialists of America - as “the principal U.S. affiliate of the Socialist International,” DSA is the largest socialist organization in US. Weatherman Underground splintered from SDA in 1969
1996-when Obama ran with the blessings of the Marxist New Party and Chicago Democratic Socialist Party
April 11, 1996- Obama attended membership meeting where he expressed his gratitude for their support.
1996-Obama was speaker at meeting of the Democratic Socialists of America (Sponsored by: University of Chicago Democratic Socialists of America )
1998- Connie Chung ABC interviewed Ayers & wife & they said,” We were young, idealistic, and We would do it (bomb) again. I wish we have done more!” This was HUGE news! Obama must have watched news!
2000- Obama was supported by leftist catholic priest, Rev. Michael Pfleger of Saint Sabina Catholic Church, in his House of Rep. race. He was another Obama’s spiritual adviser . 1995- 2001, Pfleger contributed $1,500 to his campaigns. Obama later sponsored a $100,000 earmark to help finance Pfleger’s youth center
2001- Ayers was photographed stepping on American flag and I guess Obama missed the news again? In his “Fugitive Days”, Ayers boasts that he “participated in the bombings of New York City Police Headquarters in 1970…” All told, responsible for some 30 bombings. Ayvers bragged, “I don’t regret setting bombs”, “I feel we didn’t do enough.” Was Obama blind, deaf, incredibly naive?
2001-2002, Woods Fund with directors Ayers and Obama, made grants of $40,000 and $35,000 to the Arab American Action Network, founded by radical Kashid Khalidi . Rashid is a professor at Columbia. he was strongly identified with PLO. Khalidi hosted a fundraiser for Obama in 2000.
April 2002, Obama & Ayers spoke at another panel. From 2002 through 2005, the two regularly exchanged emails and phone calls.
2004–present - ACORN and its sister group Project Vote run nationwide voter drives, which are marred by voter fraud.
2004 Obama lauches his U.S. Senate campaign.
2004 Leftist billionaire George Soros holds a fundraiser for Obama.
2004 the Communist Party USA campaigned to elect Obama to the US Senate (People’s Weekly World 4-24-04).
2004 Frank Chapman calls Obama a “communist mole”. Chapman, a CPUSA supporter, wrote a letter to the communist party newspaper hailing obama’s victory in the Iowa caucuses.“Obama’s victory was more than a progressive move; it was a dialectical leap ushering in a qualitatively new era of struggle,” Chapman wrote,” Marx once compared revolutionary struggle with the work of the mole, who sometimes burrows so far beneath the ground that he leaves no trace of his movement on the surface. This is the old revolutionary ‘mole,’ not only showing his traces on the surface but also breaking through.”
2004 In an interview given to the Chicago Sun-Times, Obama describes racist minister , Rev. James Meeks of Chicago’s Salem Baptist Church as an adviser to whom he looked for “spiritual counsel.” In 2007 Meeks served on Obama’s exploratory committee for the presidency,
April 5, 2004 Obama came out and declared, “I am a Christian,”, “I’m rooted in the Christian tradition. I believe that there are many paths to the same place, and that is a belief that there is a higher power”, “I am a big believer in the separation of church and state.”
2005 Obama purchases land at a price hubdreds of thousands of dollars beow the appraised price from his nextdoor neighboor and and top political fundraiser Antoin “Tony” Rezko who is now a convicted felon and at the center of a federal investigation.
June 28, 2006 Obama spoke at a Sojourners-sponsored Conference, calling Jim Wallis, “my friend.” Jim Wallis is a socialist “Christian” preacher, founder of Sojourners, and has long championed the cause of communism.
2006 Obama flies to Kenya to campaign openly for his radical, leftist, pro-violence cousin Raila Ordinga. Obama never condemned the violence and bloodshed instigated by Ordinga after his narrow election loss.
December, 2006, George Soros meet with Obama in his New York office.
2007 Within hours of Obama’s announcement of his presidential exploratory committee, Soros sent $2,100, the maximum amount allowable. Soros believes America is an oppressive nation.
2007 Top Marxists praise Obama in article “Obama’s Audacious Foreign Policy” (06-18-07 Politicalaffairs.net, By Joel Wendland, managing editor). Wendland is one the world’s top Marxist-Leninists. He heaps praise on Obama. Is he sending a clear signal to thousands of Communist Party members that Obama is the party’s favored candidate? It looks that way.
Dec. 2007 Obama sought Rev. Wright’s counsel before formally declaring his candidacy in 2007. Wright was named as member of the campaign’s African American Religious Leadership Committee.
2007 Obama declares his run for the U.S. Presidency.
2007-2008 The structure of Obama’s presidential campaign resembles an Ayers-designed national “community organizer matrix” straight out of Maoist theory.
April 2007 The Nation reports, “Today Obama continues his organizing work largely through classes for future leaders identified by ACORN and the Centers for New Horizons…”
January 2008 & on - Joyce & Tim Wheeler, known commusis campaigning for Obama! – Joyce is Baltimore’s longtime C Py activist. Both became prominent figures in his campaign, helping to organize local canvassing and visibility events for the candidate. Tim is a National Board member of the Communist Party (CPUSA). He chronicled his experiences on the campaign trail in a blog that appeared on the Obama campaign website.
2008 Four Weatherman Underground (WU) leftists sign endorsements for Obama online at Progressives for Obama website. These include Mark Rudd, a founder of the WU.
2008 The racist leader Louis Farrakhan who earlier lavished praise on Obama, “this young man is the hope of the entire world”, “America will change and be made better.” Latest remarks at Nation of Islam rally (on U-tube), says “When Obama talks the Messiah is absolutely speaking.” and “I love my BROTHER and I want to see that brother successful. I don’t want to say anything that would hurt that brother, and I don’t want them to use me or the Nation of Islam.”
April 25, 2008 (Judicial Watch) - The chairman of an Islamic “charity” shut down by the U.S. government for funding Middle Eastern terrorists has dedicated himself to raising money for … Obama.”
June 2008 Mohamed Salim Al-Churbaji - a Syrian University student serves as a fundraiser and organizer for Obama’s campaign. His father, Mohammed Al-Churbaji, is a member of the Muslim Brotherhood with close ties to such terrorists as Abu Amatallah; leading mujahideen fighters Abu Rawdha; and Bassam Ahmad, the latter fought for Osama Bin Laden!
2008 Obama names Professor West of Princeton to his presidential campaign’s Black Advisory Council. West is a member of the Democratic Socialists of America, a Marxist, and an admirer of Rev. Wright.
2008 Obama is forced to cut ties with Robert Malley, his foreign policy advisor after the latter told the Times of London that he had been in regular contact with Hamas.
2008 Valerie Jarrett, Michele Obama’s boss, becomes Obama’s chief advisor and he doesn’t make any major decisions without first talking to her. She was born in Shiraz, Iran.
September 23, 2008 – After pouring through thousands of pages of newly released documents from archives of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge , they reveal that Obama and Ayers were “partners” in a radical education program.
Oct 2008 Obama denies his involvement in ACORN.
Conclusion & vital questions posed by Freeper Savvyguy:
Numerous of these radicals/socialists/communists were Obama’s mentors and close friends, even political allies! How could he Not be influenced? You become who you admire! You Are who You Choose to Associate with! A man is known by the company he keeps!
Obama felt perfectly at home with these dangerous people, because they all share a similar view of America and goals, to change capitalistic America into a Socialistic America! Obama is obviously, to the objective mind, at the very least, a leftist Fellow Traveler, and at worst, a Stealth Candidate.
He WILL Not even pass a security clearance as an agent for FBI or State department!
He poses the MOST DANGEROUS security risk in America’s history!
Freeper savvyguy’s sources:
1. “The Bad company of Obama Oct. 12, 2008” http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/04/11/opinion/main4009369.shtml
2. http://www.freerepublic.com/~etl/
3. http://sooshisoo.wordpress.com/2008/09/29/obamas-radical-friends-communists-marxists-corrupt-politicians-racist-mentors/
4. American Thinkers –Obama’s foul weather friends
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/09/obamas_foul_weather_friends.html
5. Wall St. Journal: the lost years, 9-11-08)
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122108881386721289.html
I agree, In William Ayers' Forgotten Communist Manifesto: Prairie Fire , which, by the way, was republished in 2006 and dedicated to Sirhan Sirhan, I noted a passage where Ayers said, "our job is to tap discontent seething in many sectors of the population, to find allies everywhere people are hungry or angry to mobilize poor and working people against imperialism." Funny how that sounds like an Obama commercial for Hope and Change. Unfortunately, Ayers also said, "We have an urgent responsibility: to destroy imperialism from within in order to help free the world and ourselves from its grasp."
I googled "people against imperialism" and found Statement by Comrade Mao Tse-tung, Chairman of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of China, in Support of the Afro-American Struggle Against Violent Repression : A New Storm Against Imperialism. (April 16, 1968). In this "statement", Mao states, "Racial discrimination in the United States is a product of the colonialist and imperialist system... Only by overthrowing the reactionary rule of the U.S. monopoly capitalist class and destroying the colonialist and imperialist system can the Black people in the United States win complete emancipation
Is this what Obama meant when he said in 1995 that "my salvation is tied to their salvation"? Is his salvation tied to the destruction of our colonialist, imperialist system?
To take it to another level In A Balance sheet of the Finnish events (April 1940), Leon Trotsky wrote, “The policy of defeatism is not punishment of a given government for this or that crime it has committed but a conclusion from the class relationships. The Marxist line of conduct in war is not based on abstract moral and sentimental considerations but on the social appraisal of a regime in its reciprocal relations with other regimes. We supported Abyssinia not because the Negus (Haile Selassie) was politically or ‘morally’ superior to Mussolini but because the defence of a backward country against colonial oppression deals a blow to imperialism, which is the main enemy of the world working class."
I could never understand why so many were vested in our defeat in Iraq. I guess I naively thought it was to blame the loss on GWB. I'm now beginning to believe that there is a faction, and I include Obama and William Ayers, who believe that if we lose in Iraq, it is a blow to our imperialism, which is the main enemy of the "working class". The others are simply ignorant, willing accomplices. They are not against war, per se. They are for our defeat. And to think, they have infested our universities and they may soon be entrenched in very powerful positions in our government.
I read somewhere that the more outrageous the fraud, the more likely it is that people overlook it because, "surely they can't believe they get away with that". Make sure they don't - go vote - and do your best to inform the skulls of mush.
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