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Report from Tbilisi
City Journal ^ | 8/20/08 | Michael J. Totten

Posted on 08/20/2008 5:30:26 PM PDT by Dawnsblood

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1 posted on 08/20/2008 5:30:28 PM PDT by Dawnsblood
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To: Dawnsblood

Gaawwwwd!

And to think we have been getting reports that we gave the Georgian army old equipment and vintage LAW’s and Redeyes.

I cannot believe this s***t! We should at least be sending them our latest Stingers and Javelins. We did it for the frickin’ Mujahedeen in the eighties.

Instead we trot out Condi to shake her finger and engage in “diplomacy.”

Ronaldus Magnus must be spinning.


2 posted on 08/20/2008 5:39:35 PM PDT by sinanju
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To: All

Prayers for Georgia!


3 posted on 08/20/2008 5:44:36 PM PDT by Sun (Pray that God sends us good leaders. Please say a prayer now.)
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To: Dawnsblood

Russian scum.


4 posted on 08/20/2008 6:15:35 PM PDT by Shaun_MD
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To: Dawnsblood
opening phase of this crisis may soon come to a close, but it is shaping up to be merely the first chapter in a potentially long and dangerous era.

And then another collapse... seems to be the cycle through which Russia goes each century.
5 posted on 08/20/2008 6:26:02 PM PDT by alecqss
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To: sinanju

6 posted on 08/20/2008 6:50:07 PM PDT by redstateconfidential (A man who lets his friends down, is no man at all.)
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To: sinanju

Don’t worry; they’ll get the latest stuff now. However, don’t despise the LAW; it can take out a PT-76 and a BMP, and that’s most of what Russia is using.


7 posted on 08/20/2008 6:55:55 PM PDT by GAB-1955 (Kicking and Screaming into the Kingdom of Heaven!)
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To: GAB-1955

I hate to bust your bubble but in my dog-eared copy of Robert Pisor’s 1982 classic “The End of the Line: The Siege of Khe Sanh” in the part about the infamous NVA assault on the Lang Vei Special Forces camp there is the passage on page 171:

“Colonel Schungel knelt in the middle of the camp, with green tracers from enemy machine guns criss-crossing the ground in front of him, and wildly-swinging parachute flares overhead [a lighting effect spookily captured in the movie “Platoon”, to give credit where credit is due], and fired a LAW at the lead tank. The shell hit in a great shower of orange sparks, but the tank kept rolling. He moved closer with another LAW, but this time the disposable launcher refused to fire. Now he was close enough to roll hand grenades into the tank’s treads, and to fire his rifle into the eyeslits. The tank kept rolling. Another team hit one North Vietnamese tank nine times with the shoulder-fired LAW rockets, and the tank kept rolling.”

The LAW couldn’t do the job during its supposed heyday on a tank so lightly armored it could float.

I don’t actually know if that’s what we supplied the Georgians with, and I have not actually seen the photographs of dead Georgian soldiers wearing and holding outdated U.S. gear that the article referred to but, if true, this smacks of utter pusillanimity on the part of GWB.

Again, Pooty is an enemy refreshingly familiar to us westerners. his nuclear chest-thumping is obvious twaddle. He’s an old-fashioned crook, he does not want to get blowed up real good. He wants wealth, power, prestige, and time to plow his recently acquired 24 year-old gymnast 2nd wife.


8 posted on 08/20/2008 7:51:01 PM PDT by sinanju
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To: sinanju
No, I'm basing it on what my brother, a Force Recon Marine, did against PT-76s in Vietnam in 1971. He got one with a LAW. Not heavy tanks, but a PT-76 isn't a heavy tank.
9 posted on 08/20/2008 7:52:42 PM PDT by GAB-1955 (Kicking and Screaming into the Kingdom of Heaven!)
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To: Dawnsblood

KGB thug turned puppet master Putin seems to want to return to a lot of old Russia. He sure has shut down domestic freedom and is becoming much more aggressive in foreign policy. Thankfully our President must have seen this coming when he looked into Putin’s soul.


10 posted on 08/20/2008 7:54:42 PM PDT by DemonDeac
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To: archy
Tbilisi is jammed with civilians who fled aerial bombardment and shootings by the Russian military—or massacres, looting, and arson by irregular Cossack paramilitary units swarming across the border.

Those Cossack "peacekeepers" again.

11 posted on 08/20/2008 8:02:25 PM PDT by Travis McGee (--- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com ---)
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To: GAB-1955

You got it , LAW, Light anti tank weapon. Even though the sheridan was light armor it used false shielding to help detonate API before reaching the hull. A heavy armor tank with auxilary armor packed on top takes one hell of a shell to stop.


12 posted on 08/20/2008 8:07:33 PM PDT by eastforker (Get-R-Done and then Bring-Em- Home)
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To: redstateconfidential

Alas, he made mistakes too.

Recent campaign commentaries have reminded us that Ronaldus Magnus’ decision to send the Marines to Beirut, in inadequate numbers, with an undefined mission (ostensibly to bail out the Palestinians—early CNN effect) that McCain voted against, was an easily forseeable disaster.


13 posted on 08/20/2008 8:08:18 PM PDT by sinanju
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To: sinanju

Well, nobodys perfect, cept Obama!


14 posted on 08/20/2008 8:10:01 PM PDT by redstateconfidential (A man who lets his friends down, is no man at all.)
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To: Dawnsblood

mark for later


15 posted on 08/20/2008 8:12:44 PM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (Happiness is a choice!)
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To: Dawnsblood
The West saved the capital. They were moving to Tbilisi. There was one night that was very dangerous. The Russian tanks were very close to the capital. I don’t know what happened, but they moved the tanks back.” And my translator, whose husband works for Georgia’s ministry of foreign affairs, made a similar guess that the West helped save the capital. “The night they came close to Tbilisi,” she said, “Bush and McCain made their strongest speeches yet. The Russians seemed to back down. Bush and McCain have been very good for us.”

What has prevented the Russians from taking Tbilisi?? Is there a line in the sand and who drew it?

16 posted on 08/20/2008 9:39:41 PM PDT by FreeReign
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To: Dawnsblood
The Russian soldiers called him and asked where he was going, if he was going to the American side.”

“The Russians said this to him?” I said.

“My husband said he was going to see his family,” she said. “And the Russians said again, ‘Are you going to the American side?’”

“So the Russians view you as the American side, even though there are no Americans here.”

“Yes,” she said. “Because our way is for democracy.”

It is really going to be a bad thing if we abandon them. It is obvious that it isn't really Georgia the Russians are attacking in spirit.

17 posted on 08/20/2008 9:42:47 PM PDT by TigersEye (Berlin '36, Moscow '80, Beijing '08 ... Olympic games for murdering regimes.)
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To: FreeReign
What has prevented the Russians from taking Tbilisi?? Is there a line in the sand and who drew it?

Primarily the two river gorges their tanks have too drive through to get into the town from the northwest. They could approach from the southeast and southern direction rather easily, but that movement would be spotted. The main factor that stopped them probably was the 5 Presidents from Eastern Europe. Russia was not quite ready for war there at this time. Perhaps they will be in a month or two. Since Russia could not finish their initial end game, they have been stalled and are playing a middle game. Using the Free Georgians in Tbilisi as hostages. IMHO. Unfortunately, they could tire of the middle game and finish the way they wanted to finish anytime now. The west seems to only have pawns on the board at present.

18 posted on 08/20/2008 10:01:02 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: justa-hairyape

That is pawns in the literary sense, not the chess sense.


19 posted on 08/20/2008 10:02:42 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: justa-hairyape
What has prevented the Russians from taking Tbilisi?? Is there a line in the sand and who drew it?

Primarily the two river gorges their tanks have too drive through to get into the town from the northwest.

There is a paved road from the northwest that comes right into Tbilisi.

The main factor that stopped them probably was the 5 Presidents from Eastern Europe.

The five Presidents have come and gone.

Russia was not quite ready for war there at this time.

I believe Russia does have the troop strength and the equipment to drive into town and take Saakasvili.

20 posted on 08/20/2008 10:22:40 PM PDT by FreeReign
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