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To: Lurker

Well, you are sounding like a marxist-deconstructionist with your argument. I don’t think the early Church when dealing with the Gnostics were interested in 21st century polemics. They were defending the faith. As for destroying the Gnostic Gospels, well they sure did not do a good job because numerous manuscripts were found in 1947.

Furthermore, the Church was not allowed to worship publicly until Constantine’s Edict of Milan in 313 AD and Christianity did not become the state religion until the emperor Theodosius in about 380 AD. Thus, your thesis that the Church used the state to persecute “heretics” from 100 AD to 313 AD is untenable, as Chrisitianity itself was the subject of persecution by the Roman state.

On the other hand, the debates against Gnosticism can clearly be seen in the Gospel of John itself, as it is a Gospel written in about 90-95 AD with a “high Christology” as evidenced by the First chapter where we read “In the begining was the Word and the word was with God and the Word was God......and the Word became flesh and made his dwellling among us” (c.f. John 1:1; 1:14).

Shortly after John’s Gospel, we see in St. Ignatius of Antioch’s writings (ca 105 to 110AD) are clear rejection of the Gnostic movement known as the “Docetists” who rejected, not the divinity of Christ, but the incarnation, that is that the “Word became Flesh”. Thus, St. Ignatius defends the incarnation by pointing to the reality of the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist.

Thus, the debates against Gnosticism pre-date the establishment of the Church and Christiantity as the state religion by over 200 years and while those debates were going on, the Catholic Church did not have the ability to use the state (i.e. Roman government) to use the courts to sanction heretics.

In summary, your entire thesis is not supported by the evidence.


76 posted on 06/19/2008 10:00:01 AM PDT by CTrent1564
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To: CTrent1564
Thus, your thesis that the Church used the state to persecute “heretics” from 100 AD to 313 AD is untenable

Except I never posited any such thing. Go back and reread what I said.

Thus, the debates against Gnosticism pre-date the establishment of the Church and Christiantity as the state religion by over 200 years and while those debates were going on, the Catholic Church did not have the ability to use the state (i.e. Roman government) to use the courts to sanction heretics.

"Sanction"...cute word. Don't you mean murder?

L

78 posted on 06/19/2008 10:40:22 AM PDT by Lurker (Islam is an insane death cult. Any other aspects are PR, to get them within throat-cutting range.)
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