Posted on 05/21/2008 10:33:34 AM PDT by Wolfie
State may try to seize sect's assets
AUSTIN — With the price care for the more than 400 children seized last month from the polygamist ranch in West Texas expected to reach into the tens of million of dollars, a legislative panel on Tuesday suggested that the state explore the possibility of garnishing the religious organization's assets to recoup the costs.
"That compound didn't grow out of fairy dust," state Sen. Robert Deuell, R-Greenville, said after a Senate Finance Committee hearing where he urged state health officials to determine whether members of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (FLDS), or even the sect as a whole, be held responsible for the cost of care. "Why should we be footing the bill when they've got assets?"
The remarks came after the panel heard testimony that providing foster care, Medicaid coverage and casework for the children from the YFZ (Yearning For Zion) Ranch will likely cost taxpayers more than $1.7 million a month for as long as they are in state custody. The figure does not include the $5.3 million for the first six weeks of the operation or the cost of providing the required legal representation for each child, which is likely to total at least $2.2 million.
The committee, which plays a lead role in drafting and overseeing the state's budget, is exploring ways to cover the near-term costs even though no money was appropriated last year for such an event. Legislative leaders and Gov. Rick Perry's office are expecting that an emergency appropriation will be necessary when lawmakers return to Austin in January, to ensure that the state's bill for the operation are paid.
"We basically need to pay what it's going to cost to do the job right, and we need to know, to the best of your ability, what that cost is so we can factor that in when we're making decisions about other worthwhile costs and needs in this state," said Sen. Steve Ogden, the Bryan Republican who chairs the finance panel.
Law enforcement officers and officials from Child Protective Services rounded up the children from the ranch in Eldorado after an anonymous caller claimed to be a pregnant, abused 16-year-old forced into a marriage with a 50-year-old. Officials now believe that the call may have been a hoax.
But CPS workers have said that the children were in imminent danger of abuse, and court hearings began Monday in San Angelo in which many parents are seeking to regain custody of the children.
Deuell said efforts should be made to determine whether any of the children in foster care are covered by the parents' private insurance. If so, he said, the state would not have to enroll them in the taxpayer-supported Medicaid program.
Albert Hawkins, the state's executive commissioner for health and human services, said it was unclear whether members of the sect have private insurance. He also said that officials have found no evidence that anyone from the sect is receiving any sort of public assistance.
But even if the adults do have private insurance, the children would still likely require Medicaid coverage, Hawkins said, because DNA testing to determine parentage is expected to take up to two months to complete.
Rod Parker, a spokesman for the FLDS, said any effort to seize assets belonging to the sect or to individual members would be an overreach on the part of the state.
"I think my response is to ask the state on what legal grounds it believes it would be entitled to take FLDS assets," Parker said in an e-mail to the Star-Telegram. "This is a country of laws; they cannot simply go after assets without legal basis."
They don't have to file criminal charges, they can file a civil case (in family court)...which seems to be what they have already done in order to gain custody...and still make the parents pay via court-ordered child support payments, that is standard in Texas, seen it happen many times, so this doesn't surprise me. The difference? Under a civil court case, they don't have to provide the parents with court appointed attorneys and there is no right to trial by jury. It is the way CPS works in Texas, they are as crooked as a dog's hind leg.
That is the reason that child abuse investigations should be taken away from CPS and given to local law enforcement. If there are credible charges of abuse, I feel the parents should be arrested and given due process.
Where did you finf the 10 nomber? I only found 6.
BTW, which social worker gets charged with kidnapping those 6 adults?
Deprivation of Rights under color of law, anybody?
Money gets passed around within this cult per orders from the “prophet”. They certainly have a huge number of women and children on public assistance in Utah and Arizona, and those checks go straight into the “church’s” coffers. You can be sure some of it has ended up at the Texas ranch.
And most of these women and children moved to Texas within the past couple of years. I’ll be very surprised if further investigation doesn’t find that a lot of them are still getting welfare checks sent to their old address. Since Texas still hasn’t pinned down firm IDs on a lot of the women and children, and so many of the surnames are duplicates (and change every time a wife and children get “reassigned”), it would be hard for Texas authorities to trace out of state welfare payments.
I think CPS should have the right to remove children immediately from a bad situation- but once the children are removed then the whole deal should be handled by criminal court- or at least use the same standards. The way it is now the state can claim abuse and the parents have to prove there was no child abuse- instead of the state having the burden of proving there was.
I think CPS needs teeth & claws to make sure they can protect children- but when the child is in a safe place then those teeth & claws need to be put away while the case is sorted out.
Evidently the sect came up with a scheme in other states to defraud the welfare system but they somehow decided not to use the same scheme in Texas? Why is that, do you think?
Do you think you are quoting me in #13? You aren't. I hope they lock away every old child rapist in this cult.
Absolutely, I am quoting you. Where are the charges that they are child rapists? Or are you denying that you are making those claims? LOL
CPS should only be a temporary placement agency called in by the local authorities when required, they should NEVER be involved in investigations, period. Teeth and claws? They have no qualms about outright lying in court, so why should we give them teeth and claws? Save the teeth and claws for the criminal prosecutor.
“They certainly... You can be sure some of it... I’ll be very surprised if... “
In other words, you have no evidence whatsoever and are just making it up as you go.
Logically, if they were trying to stay “under the radar” they would stay as far away from any kind of social services as possible. It would be a stone around their neck, inviting government intrusion into their lives.
Of course, if you have any evidence to the contrary from a credible source, please post it.
They have been in those other states for a LONG time. Plenty of time to infiltrate local government and set up all kinds of schemes. Also, they seemed to be trying to keep the YFZ ranch community very isolated, unlike the sprawling Utah, Arizona, and British Columbia communities. The whole community used a single mailing address, and this could make it difficult to get welfare, since caseworkers would insist on visiting the “home”. In Utah and Arizona, they have freestanding houses, intermingled with some houses belonging to ex-members and non-members. They can invite caseworkers over to each house separately, and have as many children there for the occasion as they care to apply for. And if they’re managing to keep a lot of the women and children on the Utah and Arizona welfare rolls after they’ve moved to Texas, there’s not a whole lot of motivation to take the risk associated with applying in Texas.
They didn’t mind government intrusion into their lives in the Arizona and Utah communities because they WERE the government in the two counties concerned. Judges, police, and other key positions were all occupied by loyal FLDS members. Very different situation in Texas.
There is plenty of evidence. You just need to take the time to read it. Visit the archives of the Salt Lake Tribune and read through the last 10 years of articles on the FLDS.
Like I said - if you have any evidence to the contrary from a credible source, please post it.
Oh I didn’t mean to give them more teeth and claws- no way- I meant I understand that they need teeth & claws to remove children when needed but should have no other power. I don’t think they should be able to do investigations either.
I like your idea of them being called in by LEO or other authorities- great idea.
That is like charging the family of the executed political prisoner for the price of the bullets and the wear on the gun. We really have come a long way.
That certainly disputes the claims of the anti-FLDS activists here that all of the women and children were on welfare.
Can you give me the names of the folks from this 'compound' who have been indicted for Child Rape in this case?
I can't seem to locate one anywhere.
L
Again, I've looked this thread over and can't find where I said anything of the sort. If you are going by the person who misquoted me, don't.
Why? You’re clearly not really interested in the facts. If you were, you’d have been reading the articles that have been coming out about this case for several weeks now. Some of those articles have included detailed information about the welfare stats from Arizona and Utah. If you really want to know, you’ll have no trouble Googling them up yourself.
Nah he’s from Utah.
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