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To: xzins

Your perspective?


5 posted on 04/30/2008 7:10:12 AM PDT by Corin Stormhands (What if Tony Almeida is the 12th Cylon?)
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To: Corin Stormhands

My perspective is as I stated in the post: The UMC codified what it already believes and practices. It believes Jesus was a socio-political figure, and his mission was to make changes based on class divisions and worldly human interests. It rejects, as an institution if not in every local church, the notions of a supernatural God and Christ and salvation of souls.

Mark Tooley suggests the UMC is beginning a slow turn to the right. Perhaps.

In the mean time, this is a last straw for me personally. I will now try to distinguish (much more carefully) church activities that support the institution of the UMC church from those that strengthen the catholic body of Christ and personal faith. And more carfully avoid all acts and givings that support the institution, including support of the professional clergy, property growth, church plants, etc. I will in some form renounce my membership. And continue to do what little I can to bring folks to Christ and strengthen the catholic Christian church universal.


12 posted on 04/30/2008 7:20:46 AM PDT by mbarker12474 (United Methodist Church: Open Hearts, Open Minds, Open Legs, Open to Anything)
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To: Corin Stormhands; DieHard the Hunter; Dr. Eckleburg; topcat54; P-Marlowe
The following was a pre-conference write-up by Dr Riley Case of the Confessing Movement, a solid, biblical group working for historic Christianity in the UMC. They did not like the idea of "transformation of the world" without something highlighting "for the salvation of souls."

It matters that Wesley (and many Methodists still) was post-millennial. He really did see a "transformation of the world" until it is the kingdom of God on earth.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure that post-millennialism works well with post-Christian Arminianism's ignoring of the depravity of man in favor of an overly fawning God. It will always become a political kingdom that gets built.

Conversion and The Mission of the Church

A General Conference petition to expand the mission of the church would add the words “for the transformation of the world…” so that the mission statement would read: The purpose of the annual conference is to make disciples of Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world.

The petition comes from the Council of Bishops with the rationale that it reflects more adequately our understanding of the mission of the church. The bishops also link this expanded definition with mission initiatives adopted by the Connectional Table. The initiatives are leadership development, congregational development, ministry with the poor, and global health.

One certainly cannot speak against the idea of transforming the world but one might raise the question as to how the world is to be transformed. One hundred years ago the church spoke about the “conversion” of the world and “the salvation of the human race.” A few years later the language shifted so that instead of seeking the conversion of the world we were working for the bringing of God’s kingdom on the earth. This reflected a theological shift away from evangelism toward social justice.

Either way our sights were high. A couple of world wars and the rise (and fall) of communism tempered our vision. Never mind. We’re back again with a big vision, a vision of transformation. But the question still remains: Are we about social betterment or conversion?

The Africans might come to our rescue. There is evidently a petition coming from one of the African conferences (this material is not in the Advanced Christian Advocate) to insert a phrase something like “for the conversion of eternal souls” to the transformation phrase. The Africans have the most to gain by an emphasis on leadership development, work with the poor, and dealing with global health. But they are also very much aware that these emphases must not be considered separately from the salvation of souls.

It will be interesting to see how General Conference deals with these proposals.


40 posted on 04/30/2008 10:04:58 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain -- Those denying the War was Necessary Do NOT Support the Troops!)
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