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To: sitetest
In that there were only four signers of the Declaration from Maryland, it would be hard for someone to represent quite precisely 8% of the population.

That's my point - if MD had an 8% Catholic population, Catholics were radically overrepresented at the Continental Congress.

It was quite literally his own personal example that caused his fellow Marylanders to elect him IN SPITE of their deep anti-Catholic bigotry.

In other words, Carroll's personal conduct - and not any prejudices about his religion - were the deciding factor in his selection as one of the four representatives of MD to the Continental Congress.

So anti-Catholic bigotry was not the impetus or the motivation for the independence movement.

If it were, Carroll would never have been allowed anywhere near the Continental Congress.

53 posted on 03/24/2008 11:40:55 AM PDT by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
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To: wideawake
Dear wideawake,

“That's my point - if MD had an 8% Catholic population, Catholics were radically overrepresented at the Continental Congress.”

When numbers are as low as these (four representatives), it's not useful to characterize holding one of them as “radically overrepresented.”

“So anti-Catholic bigotry was not the impetus or the motivation for the independence movement.”

I didn't say that it was. I merely differed with you here:

“They were, but Catholics were greatly influential in the colony and were represented at the signing of the Declaration.”

Catholics were not greatly influential in the colony at the time of the Revolution.

- They weren't permitted to hold elected office (and Charles Carroll's tenure in the Continental Congress was actually a conscious exception to an otherwise well-enforced law);

- It was illegal to say Mass in public (for a while, it was illegal to say Mass at all, but the Catholic-hating Protestants relented and permitted private Masses);

- It was possible to lose custody of one's children for the crime of being Catholic;

- In order to rid the colony of the last vestiges of Catholicism, there were periodic attempts to seize the property of clergy (the Church herself had no property, as it was specifically illegal for the Catholic Church to own property in pre-independence Maryland);

- The colony itself, originally a proprietary colony of the Catholic Calvert family, was stolen by the monarchy for the crime of being Catholic;

- Charles Carroll's father, Charles Carroll of Annapolis, found the persecution of Catholics so severe that he attempted to set up a new refuge in what is now Arkansas for Maryland Catholics.

That's why I said if by “quite influential,” you mean “not entirely snuffed out,” then that's not too far off.

You mistake the singular political success of one Catholic to make use of the sentiments of freedom to eventually free Catholics in Maryland with Catholics being generally “quite influential” in the colony prior and up to the Revolution.


sitetest

55 posted on 03/24/2008 11:55:37 AM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: wideawake

“In other words, Carroll’s personal conduct - and not any prejudices about his religion - were the deciding factor in his selection as one of the four representatives of MD to the Continental Congress.”
....actually it had a lot to do with his money...Chas Carroll was one of the richest men in all the colonies...our family knew them because we held land in the Howard district of Anne Arundel county too...but when a company of men was raised to go down to Annapolis and burn the Peggy Stewart the Carrolls were no where to be found....that’s the Carrolls for you....I’ll say one thing for them though....they know how to defend wealth....they still hold Doughoregan Manor....the largest single privately owned tract of land in the county.


57 posted on 03/24/2008 12:25:04 PM PDT by STONEWALLS
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