Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

To: Jim 0216
The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics finds a tendency towards maximum randomness refuting Darwinist evolutionist theories.

Thanks for the advice about "learning a little science". I believe I have.

Perhaps a little more study is in order. The 2nd Law of Thermodynamics does not prohibit evolution. That is an error that crept into creationist literature decades ago and has persisted there ever since, in spite of being refuted time after time by scientists.

The Index to Creationist Claims, edited by Mark Isaak, deals with this claim in some detail here:

  1. The second law of thermodynamics says no such thing. It says that heat will not spontaneously flow from a colder body to a warmer one or, equivalently, that total entropy (a measure of useful energy) in a closed system will not decrease. This does not prevent increasing order because

    • the earth is not a closed system; sunlight (with low entropy) shines on it and heat (with higher entropy) radiates off. This flow of energy, and the change in entropy that accompanies it, can and will power local decreases in entropy on earth.
    • entropy is not the same as disorder. Sometimes the two correspond, but sometimes order increases as entropy increases. (Aranda-Espinoza et al. 1999; Kestenbaum 1998) Entropy can even be used to produce order, such as in the sorting of molecules by size (Han and Craighead 2000).
    • even in a closed system, pockets of lower entropy can form if they are offset by increased entropy elsewhere in the system.

    In short, order from disorder happens on earth all the time.

  2. The only processes necessary for evolution to occur are reproduction, heritable variation, and selection. All of these are seen to happen all the time, so, obviously, no physical laws are preventing them. In fact, connections between evolution and entropy have been studied in depth, and never to the detriment of evolution (Demetrius 2000).

    Several scientists have proposed that evolution and the origin of life is driven by entropy (McShea 1998). Some see the information content of organisms subject to diversification according to the second law (Brooks and Wiley 1988), so organisms diversify to fill empty niches much as a gas expands to fill an empty container. Others propose that highly ordered complex systems emerge and evolve to dissipate energy (and increase overall entropy) more efficiently (Schneider and Kay 1994).

  3. Creationists themselves admit that increasing order is possible. They introduce fictional exceptions to the law to account for it.

  4. Creationists themselves make claims that directly contradict their claims about the second law of thermodynamics, such as hydrological sorting of fossils during the Flood.

23 posted on 02/09/2008 3:30:35 PM PST by Coyoteman (Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies ]


To: Coyoteman
In short, order from disorder happens on earth all the time.

Wow, really? I thought the scientific method contained a body of evidence and examples that created a preponderance of evidence. Got ANY examples?

The only processes necessary for evolution to occur are reproduction, heritable variation, and selection.

Gee, well, once again, got a problem there friend. Darwin's theory of evolution requires a jump from one species to another. I'd ask you again for evidence of this but its highly unlikely you have any. This is something that has never been evidenced or proved in the scientific community.

How about another reference?

Dr John Ross of Harvard University states: … there are no known violations of the second law of thermodynamics. Ordinarily the second law is stated for isolated systems, but the second law applies equally well to open systems. … There is somehow associated with the field of far-from-equilibrium thermodynamics the notion that the second law of thermodynamics fails for such systems. It is important to make sure that this error does not perpetuate itself. (John Ross, Chemical and Engineering News, July 7, 1980, p. 40; cited in Duane Gish, Creation Scientists Answer their Critics Institute for Creation Research, 1993. Return to text.)

You and many others (myself included until I learned and thought my way out) have been duped by myths the liberals been teaching as fact in school for decades (evolution and Keynesian economic theories being just a couple of examples).

24 posted on 02/09/2008 4:02:07 PM PST by Jim W N
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies ]

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article


FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson