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To: bpjam
Who the hell was hunting or sport shooting in 1776

Washington and Jefferson for starters. Both were members of the "Gun Culture", and also big time gun nuts.

But of course that isn't why it's in the Constitution. It's in there for two, perhaps three, reasons, depending upon how one looks at it.

The first reason was to obviate the need for a large standing army to protect the country from invasion, at least until a regular army could be mobilized. They described such a standing army as "the bane of liberty". The second and related reason was to be able to overwhelm that whatever size army the Federal government fielded, should the federal government become tyrannical. Thus they wanted a "well regulated militia", one properly trained and equipped for that function, which could only exist independent of Congressional actions, if the right of the people to keep and bear arms was protected.

"One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them.
"Thomas Jefferson -- Letter to George Washington, 1796. ME 9:341

"None but an armed nation can dispense with a standing army. To keep ours armed and disciplined is therefore at all times important, but especially so at a moment when rights the most essential to our welfare have been violated."
--Thomas Jefferson to -----, 1803. ME 10:365

"A well-disciplined militia, our best reliance in peace and for the first moments of war till regulars may relieve them, I deem [one of] the essential principles of our Government, and consequently [one of] those which ought to shape its administration."
--Thomas Jefferson: 1st Inaugural, 1801.

"A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun, therefore, be the constant companion of your walks."
-- Letter to Peter Carr, 1785. ME 5:85, Papers 8:407

As to who are the militia, Jefferson tells us that as well

"[The] governor [is] constitutionally the commander of the militia of the State, that is to say, of every man in it able to bear arms."
--Thomas Jefferson to A. L. C. Destutt de Tracy, 1811.

where does this anarchy exist? where did it ever exist, except in the single instance of Massachusets? and can history produce an instance of a rebellion so honourably conducted? I say nothing of it's motives. they were founded in ignorance, not wickedness. god forbid we should ever be 20 years without such a rebellion. the people cannot be all, & always, well informed. the past which is wrong will be discontented in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive; if they remain quiet under such misconceptions it is a lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. we have had 13. states independant 11. years. there has been one rebellion. that comes to one rebellion in a century & a half for each state. what country before ever existed a century & half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve it's liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? let them take arms. the remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. what signify a few lives lost in a century or two? the tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. it is it's natural manure.
Thomas Jefferson to William Smith, Paris Nov. 13. 1787.

At a time, when our lordly masters in Great Britain will be satisfied with nothing less than the deprivation of American freedom, it seems highly necessary that something should be done to avert the stroke, and maintain the liberty, which we have derived from our ancestors. But the manner of doing it, to answer the purpose effectually, is the point in question. That no man should scruple, or hesitate a moment, to use arms in defence of so valuable a blessing, on which all the good and evil of life depends, is clearly my opinion. Yet arms, I would beg leave to add, should be the last resource, the dernier resort.
George Washington letter to George Mason, Apr. 5, 1769

When we assumed the Soldier, we did not lay aside the Citizen; and we shall most sincerely rejoice with you in the happy hour when the establishment of American Liberty, upon the most firm and solid foundations shall enable us to return to our Private Stations in the bosom of a free, peacefully and happy Country.
Reference: Maxims of George Washington, Schroeder, ed. (94)

156 posted on 02/04/2008 10:12:38 PM PST by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: El Gato

I’m assuming you agree with me that the 2nd amendment had nothing to do with sport shooting or hunting which was the thrust of my argument.

But I enjoyed the elboration you provided. And it is so so so impolitic these days to point out that the real purpose of the 2nd Amendment very well may be to defend oneself from a dictator in D.C. in the form of our Federal government. Its just not something you can say in polite Georgetown society.


320 posted on 02/06/2008 5:13:24 PM PST by bpjam (I'll crawl over broken glass to vote against McCain (or the Huck))
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