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To: baybabe
Too bad you can't grasp that paying a lower effective tax rate translates into lower prices.

In other words, all you have is theory, you can't give specific examples of what prices will be lower, or by how much.

You don't seem to grasp the idea of an expanded tax base taxed at a lower rate bring in the same amount of money.

What I grasp is that just about every time I make a purchase of a good or service, I will be taxed (tax base). To know what I'm paying in taxes, I would have to keep all my receipts and add them up at the end of the year and compare the tax I have paid with the tax I paid on income. In other words, to compare income taxes paid with FairTax paid is a cumbersome endeavor and would require more time to figure and pieces of paper to keep than the income tax.

The GSTs of these other countries seem to be your interest; they certainly are not mine.

I have an interest in real world examples. What the Australian GST gives us is an example of the economic effect the implementation of a consumption tax has on economic activity. Honestly, I predict the Australian experience was mild compared to what we can expect with the FairTax - 1. because the GST is lower than the proposed FairTax rate; 2. because the GST is a VAT and harder to evade.

Most countries stuck in the VAT tax form now realize that what it really amounts to is a neat way to balloon corruption and bureaucracy and is easily evaded.

VATs exist because a sales tax at higher rates are very difficult to collect. Sales tax evasion exists right now in this country even though rates are relatively low. When rates are as high as the FairTax would be, the motivation to evade is powerful.

It's truly too bad that you don't have some sort of positive presentation of your preferred tax system to accomplish all that the FairTax does - but then again you seem to realize that there isn't one.

Tell you what, give me 20 million bucks and and I'll see what I can come up with.

What I realize is that The FairTax is riddled with flaws that stick out like a sore thumb to those who have not been sprinkled with Fairy dust.

631 posted on 02/05/2008 10:09:27 PM PST by lucysmom
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To: lucysmom
No - it merely isn't necessary to give you the many examples you cite so that you'll dispute them and/or merely ask for more claiming "that isn't enough". That's the nonsensical way you attack-bots proceed in most cases. So no further information is needed since the prices, tax included, will typically be lower than at present since the effective income tax rate is higher now.

No one asked you to "retain all your receipts" - that's merely the straw man (or woman) you dug up to make a shallow pretense of an argument. There are easier ways of arriving at the same information but apparently you can't think of any. That's your problem and not a failing of the FairTax.

The GSTs you cite as "lower" are only a part of the combined federal taxation laid on the populace in those countries and even those VAT portions are typically greater that the effective FairTax rate would be for most. So your attempt to take only a portion of the federal taxes the folks pay in those countries still fails. And the GSTs aren't "harder to evade" as most of the VAT countries (including those you mention) have discovered with the faking of invoices and other tax related paperwork while building a large bureaucracy built on that very paperwork. In a lot of respects it's as bad as our present income tax.

Your lame agreement that you have no tax system you back is really funny in view of the number of years you've spent attacking the FairTax and its supporters. And it's "riddled with flaws that stick out like a sore thumb" is even funnier since you've never been able to make a decent attack out of any of them despite continual attempts. Certainly I'd not give you 2-cents to come up with a tax plan. I'm pleased with the FairTax as it stands as are many others - and you have no competing tax plan to offer; that much is crystal clear.

632 posted on 02/06/2008 4:09:34 PM PST by baybabe
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