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To: AndrewC
I will measure it Monday, so be prepared for the numbers.

Looking forward to hearing your input. In the meantime, I hope you are enjoying your holiday!

227 posted on 12/29/2007 1:35:55 PM PST by calcowgirl ("Liberalism is just Communism sold by the drink." P. J. O'Rourke)
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To: calcowgirl; Cyropaedia
Why do you two argue so vehemently about this when it is so simple? Tomorrow Duncan Hunter could submit legislation that clarifies 924 in how it applies to LEO’s, in other words that it doesn’t apply (was never meant to) to a federal agent when they use their service gun in the normal course of their duties. This could exclude instances of premeditation, conspiracy or wanton disregard so they could still use it to go after corrupt cops, but cops who make a mistake in the heat of the moment are protected.

And for two years you could have been urging your congresspersons to do so. Upon passage it would have led to the immediate release of Ramos and Compean. But instead you and others would rather spend two years ranting about a pardon or the new world order and how Jorge Bush is implicit with Mexico in a worldwide scheme to enslave humankind...while R&C rot in jail.

Now you will come on and say how maybe you didn’t SPECIFICALLY do all of this yourself, but everyone around you does and you haven’t lifted one finger to your keyboard to contradict them or clarify that is not part of your agenda. So while you agree with them or not your silence has emboldened and enabled them so that makes you part of their agenda.

I guess now you will spend two years arguing whether 924 can be clarified because that’s two more years of prison for R&C and two more years of headline grabbing press conferences, photo ops and sound bites to further your not so hidden agenda.

So don’t come in here and shed your crocodile tears about your concern for R&C because you really couldn’t care less. If you did you would stop this stupid push for a pardon (which is never going to happen) and it’s concurrent bashing of Bush, Sutton and our entire justice system and start doing something real to get them home with their families.

230 posted on 12/30/2007 8:22:08 AM PST by Bob J
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To: calcowgirl; Cyropaedia; Bob J
First, I was wrong on the depth of the ditch. I stated that the depth was at least twenty feet deep. It was 16 feet deep. I should have stated that it appeared 20 feet deep at night. Which it certainly did.

Second, Happy New Year!

Third, my calibrated eyes are calibrated. My eyes at night said twenty feet and they were right, but my feet were 16 feet from the water. At night with the dimness, the ditch is much more treacherous appearing than in full daylight. In any case, the ditch is 16 feet deep by two types of measurements.

The first method I used involved a rope. I attached a bag with rocks on the end of a 40 ft rope I had marked at 3 foot intervals out to eighteen feet. At nine and eighteen feet I put small knots that would indicate those lengths. I hammer threw the bag as best I could but because I had to make sure the rope would not go flying out of reach I had to hold the rope back from full extension. This resulted in the bag falling almost exactly half way up the slope on the other side instead of the top as I had hoped. I did not want to risk the rope falling in the stench pool so I lived with what I got.

I measured the length of the rope from that location and it was 28 ft 3 inches. I also measured vertical drop versus horizontal travel(the angle of the rope). The angle resulted in 10 inches of drop for 34 inches of horizontal distance(I had a yardstick). That is a 16 degree down angle. From this information I could calculate the horizontal distance as 27 feet. The long and the short of it is that the ditch is 30 feet wide at the top.

The next measurement was along the near slope. I dropped the bag into the near edge of the water and pulled it just out of the water. I assume it was out no more than a few inches but if it was out farther the depth would be calculated to more than the 16 feet. The length of the rope was 17 feet. The drop was 20 inches to 7 inches or about a 70.7 degree angle(my calibrated eyeballs at night measured 75 degrees). The result is that the ditch is 16 feet deep. Further calculations show that the water is 18 feet across. The depth of the water was not measured but appears to be about two to three feet deep. The tire that I saw the first time was in the ditch fully under water.

The second method of measuring the depth of the ditch was simply throwing a rock and timing its fall(kerplunk). I threw a rock out as level as I could and used at stop watch to time its fall. I did this four times and chose the fastest time. This was measured at 1.15 seconds. The calculated distance is around 21 feet. That is close to calibrated eyeball height.

Now, what does this all mean? It means that I was just as close at night as Bob's references were during the day(10-12) feet. It means that Davila even lied about the depth of the ditch since 16 feet is certainly a heck of a lot deeper than just slightly above a 6 foot wader. The angles verify that Juarez was lying about(or someone was) Compean falling face first into the ditch. In fact, I slipped as I measured the slope. I was sideways so I was quickly able to stop the slide by leaning on my solid footing. I can see how Compean slipped if he stepped down into the ditch. He would have gone to one knee as he testified.

On the way to the ditch, I again drove the distance at the posted speed limits and reached the ditch in 5 minutes and 31 seconds. Still no schools on the road.

An interesting thing happened this time however, when I arrived at the ditch, there was a BP truck located on the levee in what I believe would have been where Compean was stopped. I went about my business but one or two other BP trucks buzzed by while I was there. After my first measurement, an agent come down and asked what I was doing. I politely answered, but the agent replied he was not familiar with the Ramos and Compean case. Towards the end of my stay all trucks left but another one appeared and drove down on the side of the levee. A lady agent got out and asked about what I was doing and politely asked for my name. I gave it to her.

240 posted on 01/01/2008 2:43:32 PM PST by AndrewC
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