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Gloom-and-Doomers Wrong on U.S. "Moral Collapse"
Town Hall ^ | 11-29-07 | Michael Medved

Posted on 11/29/2007 11:32:21 AM PST by SJackson

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1 posted on 11/29/2007 11:32:25 AM PST by SJackson
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To: SJackson
There's too much doom and gloom from the paleos and from the Left. They are ready to write off America. Most of us believe in contrast, that her best days are still to come.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

2 posted on 11/29/2007 11:37:02 AM PST by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: SJackson

.


3 posted on 11/29/2007 11:40:09 AM PST by griswold3 (Al queda is guilty of hirabah (war against society) Penalty is death.)
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To: SJackson

Is there any wonder why we have so many Doom and Gloomers here on FR? Apparently D&G pays well.


4 posted on 11/29/2007 11:42:13 AM PST by theDentist (Qwerty ergo typo : I type, therefore I misspelll.)
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To: SJackson; Petronski; Toddsterpatriot
NEARLY FOUR HUNDRED YEARS OF “THE END IS NEAR”

Well, in any event, we're 400 years closer to the end.

5 posted on 11/29/2007 11:51:06 AM PST by Larry Lucido (Hunter 2008)
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To: SJackson
The Socialist Democrat’s Creed – “Gloom and Doom from Womb to Tomb”

A large contributor to this observation is the media's reaction, or lack of reaction, to good news from the economy to the war against terrorism and everything in between.

6 posted on 11/29/2007 11:58:35 AM PST by MosesKnows
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To: SJackson
What a bunch of pollyanish drivel.

Here is something from a real historian: The Hispanic Challenge By Samuel P. Huntington

Unless the life chances of children raised by single mothers suddenly improve, the explosive growth of the U.S. Hispanic population over the next couple of decades does not bode well for American social stability. The dimensions of the Hispanic baby boom are startling. The Hispanic birthrate is twice as high as that of the rest of the American population. That high fertility rate – even more than unbounded levels of immigration – will fuel the rapid Hispanic population boom in the coming decades.

By 2050, the Latino population will have tripled, the Census Bureau projects. One in four Americans will be Hispanic by midcentury, twice the current ratio.

It's the fertility surge among unwed Hispanics that should worry policymakers. Hispanic women have the highest unmarried birthrate in the country – over three times that of whites and Asians, and nearly 1 ½ times that of black women, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Every 1,000 unmarried Hispanic women bore 92 children in 2003 (the latest year for which data exist), compared with 28 children for unmarried white women, 22 for unmarried Asian women, and 66 for unmarried black women.

Forty-five percent of all Hispanic births occur outside of marriage, compared with 24 percent for whites and 15 percent for Asians. Only the percentage for blacks – 68 percent – is higher. But the black population is not going to triple over the next few decades.

Bureau of the Census: Projected Population of the United States, by Race and Hispanic Origin: 2000 to 2050

Currently, 1.6 million legal and illegal immigrants settle in the country each year; 350,000 immigrants leave each year, resulting in net immigration of 1.25 million. If immigration continues at current levels, the nation’s population will increase from 301 million today to 468 million in 2060 — a 167 million (56 percent) increase. Immigrants plus their descendents will account for 105 million (63 percent) of the increase. The total projected growth of 167 million is equal to the combined populations of Great Britain, France, and Spain. The 105 million from immigration by itself is equal to 13 additional New York Cities.

The 1965 Immigration Act: Anatomy of a Disaster

Immigrants account for one in eight U.S. residents, the highest level in 80 years. In 1970 it was one in 21; in 1980 it was one in 16; and in 1990 it was one in 13. Since 2000, 10.3 million immigrants have arrived — the highest seven-year period of immigration in U.S. history. More than half of post-2000 arrivals (5.6 million) are estimated to be illegal aliens.

And I will save going into the details that this country is headed for a major train wreck in terms of its entitlement programs that will start going belly up in less than a decade. This country is facing some major challenges and our political leaders are not addressing them nor is the public properly educated and informed about them.

7 posted on 11/29/2007 11:59:34 AM PST by kabar
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To: Larry Lucido

http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrl2.htm

Failed prophecies:

About 90 CE: Saint Clement 1 predicted that the world end would occur at any moment.

365 CE: A man by the name of Hilary of Poitiers, announced that the end would happen that year. It didn’t.

375 to 400 CE: Saint Martin of Tours, a student of Hilary, was convinced that the end would happen sometime before 400 CE.

500 CE: This was the first year-with-a-nice-round-number-panic. The antipope Hippolytus and an earlier Christian academic Sextus Julius Africanus had predicted Armageddon at about this year.

968 CE: An eclipse was interpreted as a prelude to the end of the world by the army of the German emperor Otto III.

1000-JAN-1: Many Christians in Europe had predicted the end of the world on this date. As the date approached, Christian armies waged war against some of the Pagan countries in Northern Europe. The motivation was to convert them all to Christianity, by force if necessary, before Christ returned in the year 1000. Meanwhile, some Christians had given their possessions to the Church in anticipation of the end. Fortunately, the level of education was so low that many citizens were unaware of the year. They did not know enough to be afraid. Otherwise, the panic might have been far worse than it was. Unfortunately, when Jesus did not appear, the church did not return the gifts. Serious criticism of the Church followed. The Church reacted by exterminating some heretics.

1000-MAY: The body of Charlemagne was disinterred on Pentecost. A legend had arisen that an emperor would rise from his sleep to fight the Antichrist.

1005-1006: A terrible famine throughout Europe was seen as a sign of the closeness of the end.

1033: Some believed this to be the 1000th anniversary of the death and resurrection of Jesus. His second coming was anticipated. Jesus’ actual date of execution is unknown, but is believed to be in the range of 27 to 33 CE.

1147: Gerard of Poehlde decided that the millennium had actually started in 306 CE during Constantine’s reign. Thus, the world end would happen in 1306 CE.

1179: John of Toledo predicted the end of the world during 1186. This estimate was based on the alignment of many planets.

1205: Joachim of Fiore predicted in 1190 that the Antichrist was already in the world, and that King Richard of England would defeat him. The Millennium would then begin, sometime before 1205.

1284: Pope Innocent III computed this date by adding 666 years onto the date the Islam was founded.

1533: Melchior Hoffman predicted that Jesus’ return would happen in 1533 and that the New Jerusalem would be established in Strasbourg, Germany. He was arrested and died in a Strasbourg jail.

1843-MAR-21: William Miller, founder of the Millerite movement, predicted that Jesus would come on this date. A massive number of Christians accepted his prophecy.

1844-OCT-22: When Jesus did not return, Miller predicted this new date. In an event which is now called “The Great Disappointment,” many Christians sold their property and possessions, quit their jobs and prepared themselves for the second coming. Nothing happened; the day came and went without incident.

1919: Meteorologist Albert Porta predicted that the conjunction of 6 planets would generate a magnetic current that would cause the sun to explode and engulf the earth on DEC-17.

1936: Herbert W Armstrong, founder of the Worldwide Church of God, predicted that the Day of the Lord would happen sometime in 1936. When the prediction failed, he made a new estimate: 1975.

1978: Chuck Smith, Pastor of Calvary Chapel in Cost Mesa, CA, predicted the rapture in 1981.

1982: Pat Robertson predicted a few years in advance that the world would end in the fall of 1982.

1986: Moses David of The Children of God faith group predicted that the Battle of Armageddon would take place in 1986. Russia would defeat Israel and the United States. A worldwide Communist dictatorship would be established. In 1993, Christ would return to earth.

1988:
Hal Lindsey had predicted in his book “The Late, Great Planet Earth” that the Rapture was coming in 1988 - one generation or 40 years after the creation of the state of Israel. This failed prophecy did not appear to damage his reputation. He continues to write books of prophecy which sell very well indeed.

1988-OCT-11: Edgar Whisenaut, a NASA scientist, had published the book “88 Reasons why the Rapture will Occur in 1988.” It sold over 4 million copies.

About 1990: Peter Ruckman concluded from his analysis of the Bible that the rapture would come within a few years of 1990.


8 posted on 11/29/2007 12:02:16 PM PST by Larry Lucido (Hunter 2008)
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To: SJackson

The USA will survive even 8 years of Hillary.


9 posted on 11/29/2007 12:03:37 PM PST by Leftism is Mentally Deranged
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To: Larry Lucido
NEARLY FOUR HUNDRED YEARS OF “THE END IS NEAR”....Well, in any event, we're 400 years closer to the end.

:>)

10 posted on 11/29/2007 12:12:02 PM PST by SJackson (seems to me it is entirely proper to start a Zionist State around Jerusalem, T Roosevelt, neocon)
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To: goldstategop
There's too much doom and gloom from the paleos and from the Left. They are ready to write off America. Most of us believe in contrast, that her best days are still to come.

The "Moral Collapse" gloom and doom seems to come mostly from the "culture war" so-cons.

11 posted on 11/29/2007 12:15:25 PM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: SJackson

“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

— Attributed to SOCRATES by Plato


12 posted on 11/29/2007 12:24:22 PM PST by Popocatapetl
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To: Leftism is Mentally Deranged
The USA will survive even 8 years of Hillary.

Blasphemy! Get thee to a nunnery!

13 posted on 11/29/2007 12:25:47 PM PST by MARTIAL MONK
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To: MARTIAL MONK

You got a president sitting in the White House allowing the sovereign citizens of the USA to be over runned by illegal immigrants and you pretend all is ok in Camelot?
It is not good and yes, it can be destroyed and if you don’t believe me just look across the landscape! Surely you must see that the lunatics on the left could care less about the USA.
The USA has not been good to everyone living in the country and some hold it against the ones that work and make a living for their failure


14 posted on 11/29/2007 12:36:59 PM PST by Mojohemi
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To: SJackson
the highly questionable sexual adventures of many of the most prominent Founding Fathers, including ... Aaron Burr (literally scores of passionate affairs and persistent rumors of incest with his glamorous daughter).

Not a Founder. During the Revolution he was a capable soldier, not a political leader.

15 posted on 11/29/2007 12:42:55 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: SJackson
Well, Medved might be on to something, but I don’t think it will matter to Pat Buchanan. After all, isn’t Medved a Jewish name?
16 posted on 11/29/2007 12:45:03 PM PST by elhombrelibre (GEN Petraeus is MAN of the YEAR. Ron Paul is fool of the year.)
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To: SJackson
Well, Medved might be on to something, but I don’t think it will matter to Pat Buchanan. After all, isn’t Medved a Jewish name?
17 posted on 11/29/2007 12:45:04 PM PST by elhombrelibre (GEN Petraeus is MAN of the YEAR. Ron Paul is fool of the year.)
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To: Popocatapetl
Socrates' observation may well have been proven by the gradual descent of Athens to tyranny and the ultimate absorption of the independent city-states of ancient Greece into the empire of Phillip and Alexander the Great. When cultural restraints or self-discipline fail, governments usually step in by assuming greater powers over the lives of their citizens. The dependency created by more powerful governments undermines initiative and subverts the economic system. A century or so after Socrates' observations, his fellow Athenians were mostly unwilling to fight the Macedonians. Athens and the other city states fell.

The author may well see a glass half-full as opposed to half-empty. However, he should consider that crime rates were far lower prior to 1960 than they are today, even though public reaction to permissive judges and lax law enforcement in the 1980s and 1990s did bring overall crime rates down. Prior to 1920, divorce rates were under 5% of total marriages, and until 1960, abortion was difficult to obtain for most women even in the most liberal jurisdictions. Perhaps a high percentage of births of first-born children occurred less than nine months after the wedding in colonial times, but there were few truly illegitimate children when compared to the present time.

Michael Medved is as unduly optimistic about the moral character of this nation as Ron Paul is about the benevolence of malignant foreign nations under Islamist or Communist rule.

18 posted on 11/29/2007 12:46:10 PM PST by Wallace T.
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To: Sherman Logan
Aaron Burr ... persistent rumors of incest with his glamorous daughter

FWIW, this statement just shows Medved's poor fact-checking. I've read several biographies of both Hamilton and Burr, without a single mention of such an awful story.

The notion was actually invented by Gore Vidal in a 1972 novel, and has made its way into the popular conciousness since.

From what I can tell, the idea was never floated by contemporaries.

Frankly, if Hamilton had made such an accusation against Burr, he would have been entirely justified in killing the SOB. But Vidal made up the whole thing.

19 posted on 11/29/2007 12:54:10 PM PST by Sherman Logan
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To: goldstategop

Plenty of morality doom and gloom right here on FR, as well.


20 posted on 11/29/2007 12:56:46 PM PST by gracesdad
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