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To: ricks_place

No, I think the bolded text is very clear:

“...or is present in the United States without being admitted or paroled.”

The definition of UNLAWFUL PRESENCE is very clear: is present WITHOUT BEING ADMITTED.

If the person is in this country WITHOUT being admitted and WITHOUT a visa, they are clearly in violation of the law.

I am not sure what argument you make here. Are you saying that people who enter our sovereign nation without the permission of the government are NOT in violation of our law, and are therefore NOT criminals?

Please clarify, because that sure does sound like the argument you are attempting to make. Why are you arguing this point? If you are making the point that people cannot cite chapter and verse stating it, that is fine.

However, you seem to be saying that these people entering our borders WITHOUT permission are not actually in violation of any laws, and that people who hold the contrary view are either misinformed, xenophobic, prejudiced or bigoted.


79 posted on 11/24/2007 8:15:05 PM PST by rlmorel (Liberals: If the Truth would help them, they would use it.)
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To: rlmorel

By the way, that response was not meant as an attack...I simply cannot figure out what point you are attempting to make.

In nearly every other sovereign nation on earth, attempting to bypass the legal entry processes and enter the country without the consent and approval of the government will land you in prison, and rightfully so.


80 posted on 11/24/2007 8:24:57 PM PST by rlmorel (Liberals: If the Truth would help them, they would use it.)
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To: rlmorel
Please clarify, because that sure does sound like the argument you are attempting to make. Why are you arguing this point?

Clarifying Point - An alien unlawfully present in the United States for a period of less than 180 days is in violation of the law - an infraction similar to a minor traffic ticket. Many people have received a minor traffic ticket and they are not considered a criminal, although the law was violated. I am not making an argument so much as reading and trying to make sense of what the law states.

The border should be secured. Aliens must be determined as admissible in order to enter the US and the government must exclude 'felony type' criminals, subversives, terror supporters, and so forth. But it serves no purpose to label any 'Improper Entry Alien' as Criminal when the law stipulates Civil not Criminal penalties.

Again, I am not a lawyer but this appear to be the gist of the Federal Code.

83 posted on 11/24/2007 11:10:10 PM PST by ricks_place
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