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To: allmendream; betty boop
I was hardly quote mining the Constitution.

You weren’t?! Forgive me, but I doubt your sincerity. If you believe the phrase “To promote the Progress of Science and [useful] Arts” accurately conveys a clear understanding of the powers permitted Congress in Article One. Section Eight. Clause Eight; then do not expect me to join you in an attempt to defend your warped concept.

Is “the right of the people to keep and bear arms” a quote mine because I didn’t include the preliminary “a well regulated militia” or the conclusory “shall not be infringed”?

No. It’s an incomplete thought searching for fulfillment. “The right of the people to keep and bear arms” . . . what? “Shall not be granted”? “Shall be allowed only on Tuesday afternoons”? “Shall be subject to the whim of Congress”? “Shall be accessed only at Federal armories”? Oh, wait! I know . . . “shall not be infringed.” Brevity is pointless if it does not convey a comprehensible concept. Your example fails on that count. Worse, it (your example) exactly reverses what you did with the disputed passage, in that you offered a present participle as though it were the operative clause, and excluded entirely the main or independent clause as though it did not exist. Using your present example, it is as though you had offered “A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state” as an accurate representation of the meaning and import of the Second Amendment, while ignoring “The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.” There are, of course, people who would like us to believe that is the proper understanding, but we know that it is not.

Walks like a duck; talks like a duck. I think it’s a duck.

Among the limited enumerated powers of the Federal Government is the mandate to promote the Arts and Sciences, and yes, the specific power granted for this goal is the issuance of exclusive rights for a limited time.

There you go again. Back at the same Kool-Aid stand, trying to smuggle in the same poisoned concept. The ‘mandate’ in Article One. Section Eight. Clause Eight. is to secure “for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries” In truth, it is not a ‘mandate’ at all. It is an enumerated power. This is The Constitution; not some misanthropic Marxist/Socialist manifesto.

would hope that any true Conservative . . .

I’m a Jeffersonian liberal from before the time the term was transformed into a Liberal excrement deformity (POS) by Democrats, Progressives, Anarchists, and Marxists/Socialists, and I recognize far more than you will find comforting.

My point was that all the practices of the government of these United States will not align themselves with the religious sensibilities of all of its citizens.:

And drive every vestige of religion (specifically Judeo-Christian) from the public square, denying in the process that the Judeo-Christian tradition ever had any influence on the building of the Union. I could say a good deal more, but you have been blessed with an epistle from betty boop (see msg 179) and I do not wish to burden you and any lurkers with what she has already said so much better than I.

It is not my fault

Maybe not. Your attempts at quote-mining The Constitution tell me, however, that you are perfectly willing to allow it to be subverted and that you do not propose to do so much as lift a finger in its defense. Jefferson warned that we dare not turn The Constitution into a blank piece of paper lest we lose its protection; a warning largely unheeded. Day by day, we are seeing the results unfold before our eyes.

Jefferson weeps.

185 posted on 11/16/2007 3:12:48 PM PST by YHAOS
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To: YHAOS

Not lift a finger in its defense? I swore an oath to protect and defend the Constitution and have done so during wartime.

The Constitution says that a well regulated militia is necessary for the security of a free state, and the remedy for to ensure that there will be a militia is to not infringe upon the peoples rights to keep and bear arms. The Constitution says that Congress should promote the useful Arts and Sciences, and the specific power granted for that purpose is exclusive rights to those writings and discoveries.

Were BB’s quotes accurate this time, or just invented quotes again? ;)


190 posted on 11/16/2007 11:31:43 PM PST by allmendream
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To: YHAOS; allmendream; Alamo-Girl
Your attempts at quote-mining The Constitution tell me, however, that you are perfectly willing to allow it to be subverted and that you do not propose to do so much as lift a finger in its defense. Jefferson warned that we dare not turn The Constitution into a blank piece of paper lest we lose its protection; a warning largely unheeded. Day by day, we are seeing the results unfold before our eyes.

Beautifully and truly said, YHAOS. I also just loved this: "Brevity is pointless if it does not convey a comprehensible concept." The Constitution is amazing brief; but it definitely conveys a comprehensible concept: individual liberty under a system of equal laws. All power resides in the People and is retained by them, even though the people choose agents to execute certain narrowly defined delegated powers on their behalf. Divided government and the system of checks and balances is designed to prevent consolidation of power in the government, at the expense of individual liberty.

In short, it is a rule of law, not of men.

Kudos YHAOS for your marvelous essay/post! And thank you for your kind words.

195 posted on 11/17/2007 9:34:25 AM PST by betty boop (Simplicity is the highest form of sophistication. -- Leonardo da Vinci)
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