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Dr. Paul’s Writings › War on Terror? It’s as Bad as War on Drugs (More lunatic fringe)
Ron Paul 2008 ^ | August 22, 2007 | Dr. Ron Paul

Posted on 10/19/2007 8:51:31 PM PDT by april15Bendovr

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To: april15Bendovr
BTW, I can't understand why a FReeper with the screen name it's April 15 bend over can't find one nice thing to say about a Congressman who is rated #1 by the NTU and in the top 20 by the Club for Growth.

He may be misguided in the WOT, but it is not for the same reasons that the liberals are. He is opposed on Constitutional grounds much like William F. Buckley. Libs want to see us fail now that we are there because it advances their desire for power and votes.

Go thou and sin no more.

41 posted on 10/19/2007 11:12:52 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: april15Bendovr

AND NOW, FRIENDS AND COUNTRYMEN, if the wise and learned philosophers of the elder world, the first observers of nutation and aberration, the discoverers of maddening ether and invisible planets, the inventors of Congreve rockets and Shrapnel shells, should find their hearts disposed to enquire what has America done for the benefit of mankind?

Let our answer be this: America, with the same voice which spoke herself into existence as a nation, proclaimed to mankind the inextinguishable rights of human nature, and the only lawful foundations of government. America, in the assembly of nations, since her admission among them, has invariably, though often fruitlessly, held forth to them the hand of honest friendship, of equal freedom, of generous reciprocity.

She has uniformly spoken among them, though often to heedless and often to disdainful ears, the language of equal liberty, of equal justice, and of equal rights.

She has, in the lapse of nearly half a century, without a single exception, respected the independence of other nations while asserting and maintaining her own.

She has abstained from interference in the concerns of others, even when conflict has been for principles to which she clings, as to the last vital drop that visits the heart.

She has seen that probably for centuries to come, all the contests of that Aceldama the European world, will be contests of inveterate power, and emerging right.

Wherever the standard of freedom and Independence has been or shall be unfurled, there will her heart, her benedictions and her prayers be.

But she goes not abroad, in search of monsters to destroy.

She is the well-wisher to the freedom and independence of all.

She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.

She will commend the general cause by the countenance of her voice, and the benignant sympathy of her example.

She well knows that by once enlisting under other banners than her own, were they even the banners of foreign independence, she would involve herself beyond the power of extrication, in all the wars of interest and intrigue, of individual avarice, envy, and ambition, which assume the colors and usurp the standard of freedom.

The fundamental maxims of her policy would insensibly change from liberty to force....

She might become the dictatress of the world. She would be no longer the ruler of her own spirit....

[America’s] glory is not dominion, but liberty. Her march is the march of the mind. She has a spear and a shield: but the motto upon her shield is, Freedom, Independence, Peace. This has been her Declaration: this has been, as far as her necessary intercourse with the rest of mankind would permit, her practice.

John Quincy Adams on U.S. Foreign Policy


42 posted on 10/19/2007 11:13:42 PM PDT by KDD (A nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse)
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To: april15Bendovr

Right, the war on drugs has been highlighted by one success after another. Hardly anyone smokes hemp products anymore and anyone with half a brain can see that cocaine use is almost non existent especially crack cocaine use in the ethnic community. Thankfully, the drug turf wars are finally over and ‘drive by’ hasn’t become a part of the everyday lexicon. We should all be thankful that ‘the gubbiment’ was able to accomplish all of that without resorting to infringing upon the liberties of the average law abiding citizens. I’m sure glad that Bendovr and all the other concerned Freepers agree that RP had his tinfoil hat on backwards when he said that the war on drugs wasn’t working. Why, even a blind man can see that the WOD has worked perfectly just as advertised. Yeah, ol’ RP is just another moonbat that refuses to acknowledge reality.


43 posted on 10/20/2007 12:59:46 AM PDT by Hatband
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To: Hatband

44 posted on 10/20/2007 4:32:19 AM PDT by Mojave
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To: Milton Friedman
Milton Friedman is a tree hugging pot head. I hate liberals like Milton Friedman.

LOL!
45 posted on 10/20/2007 4:58:00 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Apres moi, le deluge.)
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To: Arthur McGowan
Arthur, you surprised me a bit here.

I was also surprised to read that there are some small groups of policemen who are supporting RP as well and solely for his position on the WOD. Apparently, they think it is more about addiction than criminality, that other more serious crimes go unsolved because resources are devoted to prosecuting drug offenses.
46 posted on 10/20/2007 5:02:31 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Apres moi, le deluge.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084; All
I never run from anything. I might sleep but I do not run.

I may like Ron Pauls view on getting rid of the IRS but his negatives outweigh the positives. I could never support a lunatic that cant understand 18 resolutions that were passed and ignored by the useless U.N. as Saddam made fools of the world. Now the President of Iran is following suit with his nuclear ambitions and providing IED's to our enemy in Iraq blowing up our troops. We are seeing our citizens killed around the world by terrorists. Would Dr. Paul protect them or tell them all to come home?

We had the Democrats who silenced members of the military that belonged to Operation Able Danger. Looks like Dr.Paul wants to ignore them as well. Furthermore, has he ignored evidence confirming that Saddam's intelligence team was working together with Al Qaeda at The Salman Pak terrorist training camp before we invaded Iraq? That evidence was brought forth by Laurie Mylroie in her testimony to the 911 Commission; Lt. Col. Buzz Patterson; Brig.-Gen. Vincent Brooks; Richard O. Spertzel, member of the Iraq Survey Group; John Negroponte in the Docex Project documents; and Commander Mark Divine, a U.S. Navy Seal.

Add all this in with the dangerous idea that we should just eliminate justice for people that want to destroy America, themselves and their families while minimizing substance abuse. Dr. Paul seems to thinks that fighting a drug war is a problem but neglecting to add that drug problems in our country are already responsible for the dumbing down of America. The people that love his stand on the WOD are not interested in living drug free. They seem to be interested in being able to use drugs with full immunity.

47 posted on 10/20/2007 6:19:17 AM PDT by april15Bendovr
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To: april15Bendovr
Now the President of Iran is following suit with his nuclear ambitions and providing IED's to our enemy in Iraq blowing up our troops.

What is President Bush doing about this? Iran (and Syria) has been providing IEDs and smuggling troops into Iraq for months now, and all Bush/Rice has done is more saber-rattling. Plus our borders remain wide open. Funny how you criticize Paul but nobody never says anything about Bush for not fighting this war as he should.

Dr. Paul seems to thinks that fighting a drug war is a problem but neglecting to add that drug problems in our country are already responsible for the dumbing down of America.

He's not in favor of legalizing all drugs en masse. He would decriminalize marijuana and industrial hemp and let the states regulate it. Cocaine, heroin, etc. would still be illegal and with the borders secured shipments of them would drop dramatically. If someone wants to use marijuana it's simply none of your business the drug is no more harmful than most prescription medications.

48 posted on 10/20/2007 6:38:24 AM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist ("Just 3 hours a day with Rudy Guiliani is all I ask" -- Sean Hannity is on!)
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To: George W. Bush

I’m pretty much a Libertarian. I don’t think the WOD is getting at the real problems at all, which are, I think: boredom, meaninglessness, and emotional agony. Government can’t do anything about any of these things, because they are caused by the prevalence of government schooling, absence of knowledge of the Creed, the degradation of culture, and the sexual revolution.

Government, of course, is promoting many of the social ills that are inducing people to self-medicate on a massive scale. We need to get rid of the income tax (which is killing families), Soshecurity, government schools (which infantilize parents), most other schools (ditto), pornography, abortion, easy divorce, “hooking up” (i.e., assembly-line fornication), shacking up, etc.

It is the human misery brought about by all these assaults on the human person that is driving people to various forms of chemical anesthesia. The WOD is a finger in the dike. Nobody (i.e., no political figure) is even thinking about doing something about the ocean on the other side of the dike.


49 posted on 10/20/2007 8:01:20 AM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Arthur McGowan; Extremely Extreme Extremist; billbears
Government, of course, is promoting many of the social ills that are inducing people to self-medicate on a massive scale.

And government is in bed with Big Pharm to peddle their own mood-altering nostrums. Much as with the prescriptions for barbiturates and amphetamine ('diet' pills) back in the Sixties and Seventies, I think we'll see these more modern mood drugs as a real problem, not a solution. And despite their availability, the WoD goes on.

Your entire post was wonderful, Arthur. Thank you for contributing that.
50 posted on 10/20/2007 8:44:53 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Apres moi, le deluge.)
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To: George W. Bush

I think far too many “conservatives” have shallow, knee-jerk reactions: People who use drugs are part of the “left,” so the WOD must be a good thing. Public schools are part of “the American Way,” so the “conservative” project must be “school prayer,” “keep-God-in-the-Pledge,” “higher standards” and “reform.”

Huge amounts of energy, time, and money have been wasted on school prayer, flag-burning, sex-education, and such sideshows, and on piddly “pro-family” tax provisions (like “education accounts, “medical savings accounts,” education vouchers, etc.) because “conservatives” have been unready to go deeper. Get rid of the government schools, and you do away with at least a dozen “issues” that are eating up time, energy, and money—as well as people.


51 posted on 10/20/2007 9:10:50 AM PDT by Arthur McGowan
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To: Arthur McGowan
Your posts make me miss the old pre-Bush FR. The one where we all knew that public schools were a weapon to indoctrinate children and turn parents into babysitters for the State's property (children).

Nowadays, it's all about being "strategic". Let's give in on this liberal idea before the libs beat us to it. (Not that they could have passed a Pill Bill or a NCLB bill unless the GOP led the way on it. Same with SCHIP nuttiness. Or the Shamnesty.

We need to move back to real advocacy of limited government, states' rights, uphold the wisdom of relying on families to do the right things for their children.

Republican nanny-state solutions are just another flavor of statism, differing only in the details and intended beneficiaries from Democrat nanny-state solutions.

I suppose this is at the core of why I support Ron Paul currently. No one else wants to talk about those principles any more. I hope he can do something to re-ignite the old conservative small-government flame. Like Reagan and Gingrich tried to do and with at least some successes.
52 posted on 10/20/2007 9:19:55 AM PDT by George W. Bush (Apres moi, le deluge.)
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To: april15Bendovr

No pothead here, but yes, I support legalizing drugs. As a matter of who owns their own body - the individual or ...?

I disagree with Paul in seeing drug use as a disease. Individuals choose to use drugs, or quit using drugs. The disease metaphor helps them deflect responsibility for for their choice.


53 posted on 10/20/2007 10:24:34 AM PDT by secretagent
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To: april15Bendovr
Yes, we did start it all with the war on drugs. He's making the point that we did fine without prohibition before the turn of the century. The net result of prohibition has been gangs, and corporatism. The more controls the federal government exerts on medical care and medicine, the easier it is for corporate interests to influence the controls. What we have now is regulation for big phrama and big medicine, combined with control over prices through socialized payments for both. The federal government has undue influence in the medical and pharmacological sectors. This is not what the Founding Fathers had in mind. And we see the steady march of federal influence everywhere we look today. This is definitely not good for America.

The 'war on terror' is clearly a notion derived from the idea of a war on drugs. Declaring war on terror means nothing. It could mean anything. It doesn't identify the particular faction of terror. It doesn't identify the nationality. While we talk about the war on terror, our borders remain open. Islamic extremists build mosques in America with State Department blessings. Saudi money influences American politics at every level. Whole regions of the planet are off limits to our troops in fighting this war on a word.

We've truly lost our way, and the mistaken thinking does actually appear to have emerged from the feckless yet incredibly destructive 'war on drugs.'

54 posted on 10/20/2007 10:27:45 AM PDT by Old 300 ("The only defensible war is a war of defense." - G.K. Chesterton, 1937)
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To: ellery
He’s right about the drug war. He’s so very wrong that there is a strong parallel between it and the war between Islamofacism and the rest of the world. In the first case, the root causes are the human desire for intoxication that in some cases turns terribly destructive, plus the government’s willingness to make war on its own citizens to try to stomp it out.

In the second case, there’s a violent, expansionist religious sect that has been able to use oil money to export itself around the world and wage war on modern civilization. I don’t see the comparison.

Paul thinks that we don't understand the problems in both cases, and therefore apply the wrong remedies.

55 posted on 10/20/2007 10:29:52 AM PDT by secretagent
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To: Arthur McGowan; George W. Bush

The time spent on those dubious political pursuits appears to be a ruse by the Rockefeller wing of the party to distract the people from the collectivism it so desperately seeks.


56 posted on 10/20/2007 10:34:29 AM PDT by Old 300 ("Great truths can only be forgotten and can never be falsified." - G.K. Chesterton)
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To: KDD
She well knows that by once enlisting under other banners than her own, were they even the banners of foreign independence, she would involve herself beyond the power of extrication, in all the wars of interest and intrigue, of individual avarice, envy, and ambition, which assume the colors and usurp the standard of freedom.

A true prophet.

57 posted on 10/20/2007 10:38:38 AM PDT by secretagent
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To: secretagent
As a matter of who owns their own body - the individual or ...?

Socialized risk is the main justification for public policy controls over risky behavior. AIDS and medical havoc wreaked by drug addiction should not be federal liabilities. That they are is part of the plan.

The worst of it is when we go to Africa and other third-world nations to socialize their risky behavior. The whole thing has gotten out of hand, and it's inevitable that it would have.

We have overextended our reach.

58 posted on 10/20/2007 10:48:07 AM PDT by Old 300 ("America is the only country ever founded on a creed." - G.K. Chesterton)
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To: Old 300

We also go to other nations, like Columbia, to fight the “disease” of drugs.

Expensive for the taxpayer, but profitable for many.


59 posted on 10/20/2007 12:04:44 PM PDT by secretagent
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To: april15Bendovr
We had the Democrats who silenced members of the military that belonged to Operation Able Danger

It wasn't the Democrats that wouldn't let them testify. The Pentagon ordered them not to testify.

60 posted on 10/20/2007 12:54:52 PM PDT by carenot (Proud member of The Flying Skillet Brigade)
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