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Posted on 10/15/2007 11:11:13 AM PDT by UKrepublican
Priest gets a visit from 'hate crime' police for expressing his views on Mubslim veil affair
A priest has been interviewed by police on suspicion of inciting racial hatred for expressing his Christian views in his parish newsletter.
Father John Hayes, 71, was quizzed for more than an hour after commenting on the case of a Muslim girl who went to court over her wish to wear a full veil in class.
A sergeant and community support officer turned up without warning at his presbytery after an allegation was made to a Scotland Yard 'hate crimes' unit.
The inquisition in Hornchurch, East London, prompted a furious row about policing priorities. In the past 12 months there have been five murders, 33 rapes, 424 robberies and 2,267 burglaries in the local police borough of Havering.
Yet, despite being accused of turning a blind eye to the inflammatory remarks of some Muslim preachers of hate, the Met still found time to quiz Mr Hayes.
Last night the priest said his 'offending' remarks had concerned Shabina Begum, who, represented by Cherie Blair QC, claimed unsuccessfully that it was her human right to be allowed to wear her jilbab, a loose gown, in class.
After hearing an interview with the girl, Mr Hayes suggested in his internet bulletin to his parishioners that it was never possible to convince anyone by argument in matters of religion.
"My point was that you have to demonstrate what it means to be Christian through your actions," he said.
"Apparently someone in my congregation was unhappy with my comments and, after waiting a year, went to the police to say he had been 'disturbed' by it."
A fortnight ago officers knocked on the door of his home next to St Mary's Church, Hornchurch. They said they had been sent by a superintendent.
"They said they had come to see if I had intended to incite racial hatred," the priest said. "I was pretty surprised. It seemed to me that political correctness had gone haywire in this situation.
"They were very polite and cordial, but I did say to them that surely they had better things to be doing with their time.
"We had a long, civilised discussion and I didn't give an inch.
"They seemed satisfied and when they eventually left the sergeant told me 'that's the end of the matter'. I felt the whole thing was a bit of a storm in a teacup."
He added: "I have the greatest respect for Islam. There are so many more similarities than differences in our religions that I feel it is a great pity we concentrate on the few things that divide us."
The decision to quiz Mr Hayes has infuriated many Met officers.
A source at the Metropolitan Police Federation, which represents rank and file officers, said: "What happened is a gross error of judgment and possibly even an abuse of power.
"The senior officer who decided on this course of action should be called to account.
"It is yet another example of the political correctness which is blighting the Met. It is plain bonkers."
Mr Hayes, who became the priest at St Mary's 13 years ago, said one of his main aspirations was to bring people of different backgrounds together. On Saturday night he organised a 'One World' evening, where his congregation brought traditional cuisine from their country of origin.
He said: "You can talk about integration until you are blue in the face, but at the end of the day it's better to do this through actions - like getting people together over some food!"
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Interesting story, cheers. Typical Mail though neglecting the facts, I think.
Prosecutions for anti-Islamic arguments, including BNP leaders= 0 (BNP leaders charged but cleared).
Islamists prosecuted for hate speech= I can think of several just off the top of my head.
So the Police came round for a pleasant, quick chat and that was it: after someone lodged a formal complaint. If this man had been arrested/charged with anything: that would be a story. This is just police doing their formal duty in investigating a complaint. That said, the police do seem to be lacking a bit of common sense/leadership at present in a wider context.
Good point.
Coming soon to the country you live in!
I’ll say it:
What is Islam based on?
Mohammed went into “trances” and fits (like epileptic fits) when he was given the “word of God” and would shout out what he was told. These would be written down by his followers. This is the makeup of the Koran.
When Mohammed was just walking and talking and acting like “normal”, his words and deeds were written down by his followers and this went into the Hadith. Now, acting “normal” for Mohammed was taking 12+ wives (including a 6 year old), taking slaves (including sex slaves), executing infidels, conducting raids for treasure, etc.
Now, this is where it gets complicated.
A large part of the words he spoke in trances were “taken back” by Mohammed. He determined them to be the work of the devil (thus they are called the “Satanic Verses” and these are the same verses that Mr. Salman Rushdie got in trouble for writing about).
Now, how Mohammed determined which verses were from God and which were from Satan I do not know.
Also, there were literally dozens of widely different versions of the Koran and Hadith floating around for several hundred years after Mohammed death until a Fatwah was decreed to destroy all but one version. Now, even Mohammed could not remember what he was told by God and forgot it (those are his words as written in the Hadith) so I do not know how the powers in charge decided which was the correct version.
Also according to the Hadith, Mohammed turned people into monkeys, you can determine a child’s sex depending on whether the male or female has an orgasm first (that advice came directly from the Angel Gabriel), dogs are evil and should be killed, that the devil lives in your nose at night (and how to get rid of him in the morning), chess is forbidden, muslims have one intestine while infidels have seven, don’t pray looking up or your eyes will be snatched away, that one wing of a fly is poison but the other is the cure, that drinking camel urine is good for you and I could go on.
And that Mohammed himself didn’t even know if he was going to heaven. If even Mohammed doesn’t know, what chance does the average muslim have?
And for some non-PC info, Mohammed was described as a white man.
Now, if you can bear it, to compare to the Gospels of New Testament.
Jesus was someone who lived a very humble life and was killed for basically saying he was a King and Son of God (blasphemy) by the powers in charge (Roman and Jewish). The government wanted Jesus destroyed and wanted his growing movement destroyed (as it threatened their power). If, after 3 days, the followers of Jesus proclaimed he has risen from the dead, (just as he predicted), and is truly our Savior, the High Officials would have wanted to destroy such a “myth.” They could have easily done this by producing the dead body of Jesus and saying “Your Messiah is still dead and so is your movement” or producing many eye witnesses of the dead Jesus. But they couldn’t.
The letters that make up the core of the New Testament were written by the eye witnesses of the events of Jesus or by their associates. They were written in just one generation when many other eye witnesses were still alive. They were written without collusion from other Apostles. Even if any of the Apostles wanted to “add” to the “myth” of Jesus, they would have done so in a very disjointed and easily detectable fashion. Yet, the main Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) that describe the life of Jesus are amazingly in harmony with one another and the small differences are consistent with what we would see today if four people witnessed a major event and wrote about the event apart from each other. The Gospels can be traced back to their sources and are basically unchanged from their originals.
The Bible (especially the New Testament) is the most investigated historical document in the history of the world. It has been investigated by scientists, philosophers and archeologists using technology undreamed of when the Bible was written. It is been desperately tried to be “disproved” for over 2000 years, yet, the Bible still stands as the truth.
The stories of Jesus still make sense to us today. It may be because they are true, it may be because they are based in love or it may be because they were written to tell the people of the Word of God.
Regards,
2banana
PS - There are many topics that could be compared - The stories of a adulterous woman is found in both the Bible and Koran. They seem to sum up each religion.
Christianity
But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. At dawn he appeared again in the temple courts, where all the people gathered around him, and he sat down to teach them. The teachers of the law and the Pharisees brought in a woman caught in adultery. They made her stand before the group and said to Jesus, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the act of adultery. In the Law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” They were using this question as a trap, in order to have a basis for accusing him.
But Jesus bent down and started to write on the ground with his finger. When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to throw a stone at her.” Again he stooped down and wrote on the ground.
At this, those who heard began to go away one at a time, the older ones first, until only Jesus was left, with the woman still standing there. Jesus straightened up and asked her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?”
“No one, sir,” she said.
“Then neither do I condemn you,” Jesus declared. “Go now and leave your life of sin.” (John 8:1-11)
Islam
There came to him (the Holy Prophet) a woman from Gamid and said: ‘Allah’s Messenger, I have committed adultery, so purify me.’ He (the Holy Prophet) turned her away. On the following day she said: ‘Allah’s messenger, why do you turn me away? ... By Allah I have become pregnant.’ He said ‘Well, if you insist upon it, then go away until you give birth.’ When she was delivered she came with the child (wrapped) in a rag, and said ‘Here is the child whom I have given birth to.’ He said ‘Go away and suckle him until you wean him.’ When she had weaned him, she came to him (the Holy Prophet) with the child who was holding a piece of bread in his hand. She said ‘Allah’s Apostle, here is he as I have weaned him and he eats food.’ He (the Holy Prophet) entrusted the child to one of the Muslims and then pronounced punishment. And she was put in a ditch up to her chest and he commanded people and they stoned her. (Sahih Muslim 4206)
Jesus
One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, “Of all the commandments, which is the most important?” “The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.”
“Well said, teacher,” the man replied. “You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him. To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.”
When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” And from then on no one dared ask him any more questions. (Mark 12:28-34)
Mohammed
Allah’s Apostle was asked, “What is the best deed?” He replied, “To believe in Allah and His Apostle (Muhammad). The questioner then asked, “What is the next in goodness? He replied, “To participate in Jihad in Allah’s Cause.” The questioner again asked, “What is the next (in goodness)?” He replied, “To perform Hajj Mubrur.”
Have a little pork barbeque, anyone?
LOL!
That's why they took the time to investigate it. This muslim woman is represented by the former First Lady of the United Kingdom. If she didn't have such a high-powered attorney, would the case have received that much attention, a year later? I doubt it.
Would you mind sharing with us those Islamists prosecuted?
Hmmm...I'm sitting here trying to figure out why I should respect a religion that kills innocent people with reckless abandon and does not have spokespeople with enough human decency to speak out against it. Sorry, but given what I have seen Islamic people do, I have no respect for Islam at all.
Join David Horowitz and Robert Spencer in their efforts to create an awareness of and stop Islamofascism.
http://www.terrorismawareness.org/petitions/63/islamo-fascism-petition/
http://www.terrorismawareness.org/
"Go now and breathe no more."
‘Coming soon to the country you live in!’
Is it just me, or are some fo these responses now fully automated? :)
‘This muslim woman is represented by the former First Lady of the United Kingdom.’
The former first lady of the UK is the late Queen Mother, God rest her soul, and the current one is Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II.
Please keep your heretical republican titles to yourself! :)
They're Queens, not "First Ladies" (and fine ones at that)! LOL! I wouldn't demote Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II or her mother, of blessed memory, to "First Lady"! LOL!
if the American left has it’s way the US will have hate crimes to cover anti-muslim, anti-homosexual, anti-woman and probably anti-DNC speech. The thought police will go wild with disgruntled neighbors telling on one another. East Germany had a lot of that going on.
You mean, like that little "Savior" thinggy; and the "saved by Grace, not works" doctrine?
Or, did you mean "Thou shalt not kill; no, not even Pagans, Heathen, Backsliders, or other Unbelievers?"
Or, how about (KJV)Matt 6:7
But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
Most importantly, he seems to have forgotten:
KJV 2 John 9-11:
9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:
11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.
Sure, mate. Heres a list of articles on separate successful prosecutions of Islamist extremists (on the sole charge relating to hate speech) that I’ve come up with in just a couple of minutes (from memory of the cases):
1)’Abu Hamza jailed for Seven Years for Inciting Murder’:http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article728117.ece
2)Four jailed for Danish Cartoon Protests so far:
Mizanur Rahman: Six years
Umran Javed: Six years
Abdul Muhid: Six years
Abdul Rahman Saleem: Four years
See:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6903445.stm
3)’Muslim cleric guilty of soliciting murder’ (jailed for nine years) http://www.guardian.co.uk/race/story/0,11374,902009,00.html
I knew it. “hate” crime laws were passed so as to put White Christian males in jail for anything that they may do.
These idiotic laws went from adding penalties to a crime because of bias, to prosecuting people for “bias” with no crime attached.
This was the original intention of the lawmakers.
To be honest, I’m beginning to wonder if our US friends version of FreeRepublic has a ‘Britain is doomed’ short-cut key :-)
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