Why Flying Now Can Kill

http://www.washingtonpost.com ^ | 10/14/07 | A.L. Bardach

[BCrago66]

I am haunted by the death of Carol Anne Gotbaum.

I didn't know the mother of three who died shackled to a bench in the Phoenix airport on Sept. 28, en route to an alcohol treatment center in Tucson. I don't know, beyond what I read in the newspapers, what troubles weighed on her. But I do know this: Based on my own recent flight experiences, hers was a death foretold.

[KTM rider]

[quote]FOX news ran some tapes from a police dispatcher from the husband calling in to make sure that the cops knew she was suicidal. (This was an hour after her death, but he did not know she had died and they did not tell him at that point.)[/quote]

It is entirely probable that the cops called to fish for this information, as a defense

.... the plot thickens ! imagine choking yourself to death with a chain ! you'd really have to be hating life !

and suicide = no life insurance payout !

[KTM rider]

[quote]If he knew she was suicidal and unstable, why didn’t he accompany her?[/quote],

maybe he was driving her nuts,(who knows)

maybe he was building up to a divorce and was hoping something like this would happen ! It would get him 100% custody of the kids

[PAR35]

There would be no need for airlines to overbook flights if they did not give refunds for tickets purchased.

You either don't fly, or you fly full fare on an expense account if you think all airline tickets are refundable.

[KTM rider]

[quote]If he knew she was suicidal and unstable, why didn’t he accompany her?[/quote],

maybe he was driving her nuts,(who knows)

maybe he was building up to a divorce and was hoping something like this would happen ! It would get him 100% custody of the kids

[3niner]

I watched the security video of this woman being restrained. It was clear that security did not overreact, but merely used the minimum amount of force required to restrain her. Unfortunately, due to her behavior, that "minimum" was significant.

Also, it was evident that eye witnesses lied (or mischaracterized or misremembered, to be more charitable) about how security handled the situation.

Something that is not mentioned in most reports, is that the woman strangled herself, while trying to get out of restraints, when she was left alone for a few minutes.

[Caramelgal]

Was she drunk or acting psychotic or just very angry and agitated that she was going to miss her flight? The fact that other passengers offered their seats to her, indicates, although does not necessarily prove, that she was not posing a real psychical threat to herself or anyone else.

What I’ve read indicates that she was on time but denied a seat because the flight was overbooked. That’s enough to make anyone agitated but in today’s environment any sign of agitation could be grounds for arrest for any of us, especially in an airport. All you have to do now days is raise your voice, even a little or make a scene to get arrested and detained. The again there is now the husband’s account that suggests she might have been drinking.

If she was boarding a plane alone on route to a treatment center for alcohol addiction, I presume she was going on her own volition, but even still, I think she should have been accompanied by someone. She should not have been left alone. Someone from her family should have been with her from curb to door. Someone going through withdrawal and detoxing needs to be monitored as they can become more easily agitated than normal and that was the family’s responsibility, not the airlines. The again you unless you have a ticket, you can’t accompany someone past the security gate anymore.

From what I understand, once someone agrees to go into treatment, they make a promise and a commitment to show up and show up on time or else they can loose their admission.

I can only conjecture on this, but I can imagine a scenario where this woman made a promise to her family and herself to get help and had done everything up to this point that was asked of her. As an alcoholic/addict, she had probably previously told a lot of lies and made a lot of excuses about showing up late and or not doing the right thing and felt it was very important that she be on time for her admission. She was probably already very anxious and under a lot of stress.

Now that she’s really trying; some snotty, arrogant airline employee (and we all know the type) tells her she can’t board and she became upset and maybe a little loud and agitated. She might have been afraid that if she showed up late, no one would believe her or left on her own for hours waiting for the next flight, she might give into temptation and the stress and end up in the airport bar. Just pure conjecture, but I can imagine her stress level and desperation.

If she was dangerously agitated and or visibly drunk then security absolutely did the right thing to detain and restrain and detain her, but I have a lot of questions about what happened between the time she was cuffed and put in a holding cell and the time she was discovered dead.

For one thing, if she was that deranged and or drunk she should not have been left alone for any extended time even if restrained. For another, if she was properly restrained, she would have to have been a contortionist and double jointed in order to strangle her own neck with her hand cuffs. How much force was used and how much force was actually necessary?

Before her arrest did anyone from the airline really try to talk to her and calm her down or was she just cuffed and led away?

This whole story begs more questions than answers.

[gitmo]

There was no injustice done except in her own behavior.

So when you purchase something, there is nothing wrong if the seller turns around and sells your purchase to a higher bidder, and neglects to tell you that you are SOL until it's too late for you to make other arrangements?

[gitmo]

There was no injustice done except in her own behavior.

So when you purchase something, there is nothing wrong if the seller turns around and sells your purchase to a higher bidder, and neglects to tell you that you are SOL until it's too late for you to make other arrangements? What if you and your child are traveling together and US Air decided to sell one of your tickets to someone else, and you are stranded in some town far from home? You either send your child on alone or you are the price of one ticket.

[Mr Rogers]

Sounds bogus to me. I’ve been on my share of overbooked flights...all have asked for volunteers to give up seats.

[flowerplough]

“I don’t understand why SOMEONE in her near/immediate family didn’t accompany her to the treatment center.”

I think I may understand why Mrs. Gotbaum was travelling alone. I’d guess that her millionaire husband and her Public Advocate mother (mother-in-law?) were sick of her and were simply no longer concerned with her welfare.

[Contra]

They shouldn’t let a nut case like this fly anyway, she would have been a threat to all on the plane. It’s good she only took herself out and not others.

[Kimmers]

“Wasn’t she drunk when she checked in at the gate and exhibited psychotic behavior?”

Exactly,there is a difference between the author of this article and Ms. Gotbaum. Ms Gotbaum was not rational in her behavior which may have been due to alcohol or a mental disorder. The author was frustrated but rational in her behavior.

Ms. Gatbaum’s family claims to be so loving and concerned about her mental health after her death, why was she flying unaccompanied?

I think the family has responsibility here and not the airline.

[Neidermeyer]

and suicide = no life insurance payout !
**************************************
Negative , life insurance will pay on suicide if the policy is at least 2 years and 1 day old, this applies even if you withheld information or fudged certain health facts , they have a certain amount of time to discover the truth. The assumption is made that no sane person would plan a suicide that far in advance.

[Don W]

Perhaps if you actually READ the article rather than knee-jerk babbled:

#1 (direct quote from the article) though much has been made about her going to an alcohol rehad center, no one saw her in the bar.

#2 She was at her gate 25 minutes early for her RESERVED seat.

#3 She was denied access to the flight she had reservations on, the following flight, and a third before she got very upset.

Have you no compassion at all, or is your soul so filled with disdain for those who show weakness that you consider their plight beneath your high and mighty notice?

I pity folks with so petty a mindset.

This woman did most assuredly NOT deserve to die just because some petty little counter clown would not allow another passenger to swap with this obviously distraught woman. IMHO the counter clown(s) on duty that day should be charged with negligence contributing to death.

[NativeNewYorker]

The reason Ms. Gotbaum is dead is because her millionaire husband and Public Advocate mother-in-law couldn't take one day out of their busy lives to escort a seriously ill woman to a treatment center.

We have a winner.

[KTM rider]

Yep those pretty little women can really be a handful,

.... and the cops would NEVER ever lie, omit or embellish to save themselves, after all they are superhuman.

on the other hand, 3 impartial eyewitnesses are only mere mortals, and not to be trusted [/sarcasm]

I have a few cop buddies and it sure seems like there are three things they would want to be able to impose an instant death penalty for, evading arrest, resisting arrest, and assaulting an officer.

[KTM rider]

[quote] I think I may understand why Mrs. Gotbaum was travelling alone. I’d guess that her millionaire husband and her Public Advocate mother (mother-in-law?) were sick of her and were simply no longer concerned with her welfare.[/quote]

exactly, many millionaire husbands have mistresses and have illicit affairs. They are also more often than not, narcissistic and type A, very controlling people (or they would not have millions). They would also be able to calculate the cost of a divorce over the effort it would take to drive a weak person crazy and to self destruct. A crafty millionaire could easily afford detectives and attorneys to build a case against a woman who had drinking problem and take the kids away, and hold that over her head so she wont file for divorce and get half his fortune.

I don't assume that mrs Gothbaum was the evildoer here, there are a lot of bully husbands in this world (wives too)

But then, all that is wild speculation , like most of the other wild speculation being tossed around here.

[NonValueAdded]

Easy there, sport. You are taking everything said in the article at face value. She did NOT have a reserved seat. The family itself said she missed her original non-stop flight because she wanted to spend more time saying good bye to the kids. I have a theory about that borne out of experience, but it's not all about her. In defence of the family as to why they didn't accompany her on the rescheduled flight, it was probably because the airline would not make a reservation on an overbooked flight (the second leg) for a brand new ticket for a tagalong. How ironic is that?

US Air was bending over backwards to accomodate her. The real irony here is if US Air had a strict no overbooking policy as the author seems to advocate, she'd still be in New York since they didn't have a seat for her on the second leg. I was wondering how someone would be denied boarding on a second or subsequent leg, other than a missed connection scenario and it dawned on me, she was flying standby. To switch her out would be a luggage nightmare because of the new TSA regs. Blame Osama for that. US Air did guarantee her a seat on the next flight but she caused a scene anyway.

I don't want to make it all about her and no, I have personal reasons for an empty well when it comes to compassion for a substance abuser. But let's not resort to the "hey, you're blaming the victim" reply. Ultimately she is the one who screwed up here, not US Air, at least in this case.

[FunkyZero]

Go to the US Airways homepage, they have a google search field. Type in “overbooking” and see what google results you get. Now go directly to google and type in “overbooking” and see if there is a difference. Or I can save you the hassle and just tell you, the difference in number of hits is 790,000. The US airways link provided a whopping ZERO.

I just thought it was funny, sorry.

[GoShow]

LOL - US Air is an equal opportunity discriminator - taken (N-Rape) money from any consumer.