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To: Natural Law
We can all agree that the right to secede is not expressly "prohibited" to the States in the constitution.

Can we also agree that the word 'expressly' is nowhere to be found in the Amendment? And that implied powers, as outlined by Chief Justice Marshall, also exist? And that those implied powers could be delegated to the United States or denied to the states?

This textual reading is buttressed by the historical fact that the States had the right to secede in 1776 and did not expressly give up that right in ratifying the Constitution.

Actually, no. A textual reading of the Articles of Confederation make it clear that it was a perteptual union.

To the contrary, several states, including New York, in their acts of ratification, noted that "the powers of government may be reassumed by the people, whensoever it shall become necessary to their happiness."

In those ratification documents was also a statement saying that they ratified the Constitution as passed by the convention. The Constitution proclaims itself the supreme law of the land, and if anything, including ratification documents, conflict with it then the Constitution overrules them. According to the Supreme Court the right to secede unilaterally is not in the Constitution.

76 posted on 08/27/2007 4:59:18 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur (Save Fredericks-burg. Support CVBT.)
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To: Non-Sequitur
Actually, no. A textual reading of the Articles of Confederation make it clear that it was a perteptual union.

But this undercuts your argument. I agree that the Articles stated that it was a perpetual union, but that just demonstrates that the framers, if they were so inclined, easily could have so specified in the Constitution. But they did not. The framers were all bright, intelligent people. If they had meant for the Union to be perpetual, why did they not specify that in the Constitution as they had the Articles?

Because a basic rule of construction is to assume that the inclusion or absence of clauses is deliberate, why do you think that the framers specified a perpetual union under the Articles and the deliberately chose not to specify that under the Constitution? This certainly points to the conclusion that our Constitutional union is not perpetual, but is rather one that can be exited (though not entered) at the will of the states.

158 posted on 08/28/2007 6:43:43 AM PDT by Publius Valerius
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To: Non-Sequitur
"according to the supreme court" MURDER of the UNBORN is also legal, as was "separate but equal" and numerous other STUPID decisions of the ussc.

free dixie,sw

192 posted on 08/28/2007 9:29:58 AM PDT by stand watie ("Resistance to tyrants is OBEDIENCE to God." - T. Jefferson, 1804)
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To: Non-Sequitur
Can we also agree that the word 'expressly' is nowhere to be found in the Amendment?

The words "lightbulb", "goat", and "purple" are also not in that Amendment. So what? The intent was that powers not delegated to the United States are reserved to the states.

James Madison:

The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the Federal Government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, be connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the State.

216 posted on 08/28/2007 11:47:57 AM PDT by FreedomCalls (It's the "Statue of Liberty," not the "Statue of Security.")
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