Posted on 08/13/2007 7:13:07 AM PDT by flowerplough
I read through the mess that this thread has become and I think that the thread should be locked and all posts deleted except for your post. Finally a straightforward commonsense opinion.
I read through the mess that this thread has become and I think that the thread should be locked and all posts deleted except for your post. Finally a straightforward commonsense opinion.
Men + women + uniforms + military service = TROUBLE
I'm sympathetic to your cause, but I find these statistics suspect. What evidence is there that 12% of women have been sexually assaulted? How would you know that they had been, if they "will not come forward"?
Rape is no joke, and it has to be taken seriously. There are no shortage of Neanderthal attitudes towards it - but your cause is not aided by repeating dubious statistics.
That reminds me of a very non-PC Redd Foxx joke.
Most statistics are bogus beyond comprehension. Whatever the number, it gives no real sense of how, when, or why things happen, nor to whom (if anyone).
Then we lived that joke in Korea........:o)
Stay safe !
“You have to admit, though, refusing to answer questions, does not reflect well on her position.”
Have you ever been raped? Have you ever sat in front of a male officer questioning you with the look in his eyes that he doesn’t believe a word you are saying?
If your answer to either of these questions is no, you should not judge.
“That’s the best you can do is post a sign up date?”
That is their pathetic way of trying to discredit you. Because you haven’t been her for more than three months you opinion does not count in some people’s opinion.
Thank you for your previous post.
If your answer to either of these questions is no, you should not judge.
By that logic, most of the anti war protesters don't have the right to say that war is bad, simply by the fact that they have never been in a war, never been oppressed by a brutal dictator, etc. Yeah, that's an intelligent line of thought; NOT!
Why does the fact that a woman alleges rape put her above reproach? Men don't get the same benefit.
The basis of this argument isn't about rape, we all agree that it is bad, and those who do it need to be punished to the full extent of the law; if not further.
The basis of this argument is that Feminists want to cast all women as victims, and all men as predators. In doing so, they want to remove any culpability from the woman's side of the equation, and place it squarely on the man's shoulders; facts be damned.
In cases of male on female rape, when it does occur, all women are victims. Some women, and I will go as far to say that a disappointingly large number, are not only victims of the men, but also of their own stupidity.
Refusing to move forward, for whatever reason, once the allegation has been made doesn't make it look like the woman backs her own story. If she doesn't, then why should society?
“By that logic, most of the anti war protesters don’t have the right to say that war is bad, simply by the fact that they have never been in a war, never been oppressed by a brutal dictator, etc. Yeah, that’s an intelligent line of thought; NOT!”
How did this argument become about the war. This is about a woman who alleged rape then was too afraid in my opinion to testify.
“Why does the fact that a woman alleges rape put her above reproach? Men don’t get the same benefit.”
I never said she was above reproach. I am just sick and tired of people saying that whenever a woman alleges rape, then she in some way asked for it. That is assuming far beyond you knowledge of the situation.
“The basis of this argument isn’t about rape, we all agree that it is bad, and those who do it need to be punished to the full extent of the law; if not further.”
The basis of my argument is about rape. That is what this article was about. I did not enter into a discussion about war, or about feminism, it was about rape.
“The basis of this argument is that Feminists want to cast all women as victims, and all men as predators. In doing so, they want to remove any culpability from the woman’s side of the equation, and place it squarely on the man’s shoulders; facts be damned.”
I agree, there are some situations where a woman puts herself in a situation where bad things can happen. But in the situation where she is among people she considers to be friends and something like this happens, how is it her fault?
“In cases of male on female rape, when it does occur, all women are victims. Some women, and I will go as far to say that a disappointingly large number, are not only victims of the men, but also of their own stupidity.”
I will give you that, but it seems that every rape thread here slants this as some loose woman who has had too many drinks or had consentual sex and then claimed rape just because the diamond bracelet she was given turned out to be paste. That again is jumping to some pretty big conclusions.
“Refusing to move forward, for whatever reason, once the allegation has been made doesn’t make it look like the woman backs her own story. If she doesn’t, then why should society?”
Again, unless you have sat infront of an officer questioning you about something that is the most shameful thing that can happen while being looked at as a whore, you have no idea what caused her not to testify. In case you know nothing about the feelings let me summarize.
You feel like you have done something to warrant the act. You are ashamed because you are certain that he is running back to all his friends telling them how easy you were, even when you said no. You know you will probably have to face all of those same people again and they will know what happened. All of a sudden a very private matter has become public knowledge. You can no longer look anyone in the eye and not wonder, “do they know?”.
Now add to that a hostile interviewer with a note pad, tape recorder and possibly another person in the room for a witness and you are sitting there without anyone on your side. Do you talk? If you talk and they write down your feelings, about self guilt, do you testify knowing that it sounds like you agreed to it because you felt like there was something you may have done to provoke it. Maybe you shouldn’t have laughed at a joke he made. Maybe you shouldn’t have stood within 10 feet of someone you thought you could trust. Maybe you shouldn’t have worn makeup to go out with the crowd.
I hope you can begin to see and feel what it might, just might be like for this young woman.
***********
Why? Blame the "Women's Movement", particularly N.O.W. for brainwashing women into believing that women are victims and men are animals. It's insulting, and serves neither sex. The "Duke" case is a shameful example of how far this attitude has gone.
It's not about the war, it's about flawed logic; which is the crux of this whole thing. If you can't see the point, there is no use even reading the rest of your post or trying to get through to you, as you've already made up your mind. No facts, no argument towards reason, nothing anyone says, and nothing anyone does will change you position.
Welcome to the world of liberalism, the exit door is on the left.
Typical answer from someone who refuses to see that there is more to this argument than flawed logic. How is it flawed logic when someone is assaulted. If she had only been beaten, then how does that change things for your opinion. I am not a liberal and am far from it. I believe in the death penalty, I believe in right to life, and I don’t appreciate being attacked for my opinion. You are afraid to read the rest of my post because you are afraid you may actually have to care about someone other than yourself.
I believe his name fits him.
If you’re talking about Turbo Pig, I’m afraid I must disagree. He makes a lot of sense to me.
I'd guess a lot of 'rapes' are actually next-day regret.
No does indeed mean no. But if both of them are drinking and nobody says 'no', then who raped whom?
Yuo should be disgusted by this alleged 'victim' and others like her that by all available evidence, are making up the charges. She has an obligation to testify. Until she does, the men are innocent and she has slandered them.
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