[Hank Kerchief]

PHILOSOPHY PING

(If you want on or off this list please freepmail me.)

Hank

[snowrip]

A timely piece, given that the US senate will be voting to grant amnesty to the largest bunch of undisciplined, degenerate criminals on Earth.

Mexicans are the only group of immigrants in American history to remain balkanized years after their arrival... and wherever they settle in large numbers they bring all the markers of an uncivilized society with them; violence, crime, drugs, gangs, illiteracy, and civil unrest are the hallmarks of the barrios which have sprung up across our nation.

Although some other countries would never admit it, America has built upon the ideals of Western civilization to create our own culture. Ours is a history and a spirit of sacrifice and of self-determination. It is a tradition of independence, of self-reliance, of hard work, of courage and of responsibility. We are a civilization built on principles; most importantly, we are a legacy of freedom and a society of laws. THIS IS OUR CULTURE, and it is as unique and as deserving of respect as any other. To become an American means to stand up in unwavering support and in reverence of these essential things, to belong to something that is larger and more powerful than any individual, and to accept this culture as your own. It means not a surrender of your heritage, but an integration of your way of life into that which is American.

[Mr. Jeeves]

The Fifties offered a culture that worked - but it was a very stifling, limiting culture, and required citizens with character forged in the Depression and WWII to pull it off. There is little point in being nostalgic for those days. They are never coming back. The biggest negative change since then is the condition of our inner cities, and blame for that rests squarely on the shoulders of Great Society liberalism.

Americans need to focus on developing our new and hard-won strengths rather than decrying the things we think we lack or have lost. Trying to translate Fifties nostaglia into a political platform is ultimately self-defeating.

[NaughtiusMaximus]

If this description sounds like today's society and culture it is because the spirit of the fifties is now lost forever. We are again in an age where nothing is revered and the utmost contempt is poured on anyone who holds anything sacred. It is why it is almost impossible for anyone today to understand the spirit of the 50s.

Wise words, very wise.

[Lurker]

Courtesy is not conforming to social convention and not a limit to free speech.

Courtesty, or good manners if you will, is what makes it possible for large numbers of us to live in close proximity to each other without killing each other.

L

[kalee]

ping

[Donald Rumsfeld Fan]

...... provides a picture that perfectly traces the rapid cultural and social decline in civilization after the end of the 1900s through the end of the 30s, the rapid return to civilized values through the forties, the highest level of civilization in this century through the fifties, and the final decline in that civilization through the 60s to the lowest period in the history of this country from the end of the 60's to today.

His data seems to undermine his own assertion "we can't go back".

The greatest generation and their parents after being hammered by the "Great Depression" and WWII, experienced a renewal in the 40s and 50s.

The 20s and early 30s were a time of lawlessness and relative depravity.

The PC and nanny laws of today are much more stifling and oppressive than anything I experienced growing up in the 50s.

[RightWhale]

Polite has the same root as politics and police.

[jpl]

I'll point out the obvious, which is that American society in the '50s probably seemed less than fully civilized if you happened to be black.

But it would be really nice if we could somehow go back and recapture the good aspects of society that we had back then, while at same time keeping the progress that we made in basic civil rights.

[SamAdams76]

Despite all the rosy pictures people like to paint of the 1950s, it really sucked to be a black man. Or a woman who wanted a career.

Also, if you liked good beer, good luck finding it in the 1950s.

[Tailgunner Joe]

The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of his tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men

Is civilization not ruled by laws?

Savages have no law other than the law of the jungle. Civilized society cannot exist without law.

People were jealous of their privacy which they regarded a recognition of one's own being as an independent individual. To have one's own privacy violated or to violate another's was tantamount to physical assault. One's thoughts, one's body, one's business were their own, to be shared or not by their own choice.

How is privacy to be enforced? Isn't it the right of a free person to try to find out information about other people? Isn't it it the right of a free person to communicate such information to others? To what extent should the violent force of government be used to protect privacy?

People minded their own business, and expected others to mind theirs—it was part of their decency.

Is it decent to claim that the right to privacy includes the right to murder the unborn?

[beavus]

The crime statistic is interesting, but most of the article smacks of selective memory and exaggeration. I suspect his view of the 50’s has much to do with his young age when he experienced it. Statements like “adults, a status that, in those days, had to be earned, and was not conferred simply because someone had lived a certain number of years” don’t even make sense. Or distinguishing the 50’s as a time when people had something to live for—this sounds like an unhappy man projecting his dysthymia on an entire generation.

It is true that a growing cultural irreverence, well-earned by our politicians during the Vietnam era, has led to a gritty indecency in popular movies and music, which has been emulated by many everyday people. It has lead to a well-earned disrespect for government institutions and leaders and a coarsening of political rhetoric.

I for one like the trend. Election to public office does not merit respect, and that people are willing without hesitation to call their public leaders to task is an advancement over the 1950’s. It might be better if it happened without cursing, screaming, and incivility, but the important thing is that it is happening. The times when people cowered before the title of “Senator” or “Governor” I hope are over. Tomorrow’s grandmother hopefully will not dream of her grandchild becoming President, but rather of doing something valuable with his or her life.

Part of the reason such reverence for the civility of the 1950’s falls on deaf ears is because of the 50’s skeletons in the closet—widespread racism and condescension of women. Saying “Thank you ma’am” in one breath and “back of the bus N*****” in the next is hardly endearing to someone with a modern more consistent view of human respect.

The 1950’s was also a time of 91% marginal tax rates, the golden age of American unions, injection of religious fundamentalism into government, and some of the worst sha-boom music the world has ever seen.

There is much to be praised about the 50’s to be sure—especially if “Leave it to Beaver” is nonfiction, but this guy’s article is really out of balance.

[potlatch]

American society of the fifties was dominated by young and middle-aged people who were the most civilized of the entire 20th century.

[r9etb]

If this description [of the 20s] sounds like today's society and culture it is because the spirit of the fifties is now lost forever. We are again in an age where nothing is revered and the utmost contempt is poured on anyone who holds anything sacred. It is why it is almost impossible for anyone today to understand the spirit of the 50s.

Firehammer's overall point may or may not be right -- I couldn't finish the article -- but his reasoning in this statement is ludicrous: essentially, he offers the frivolity of the 20s as proof that the "spirit of the 50s" is now "lost forever." And yet, according to my calendar, the 50s happened after the 20s ... clearly it is possible to recover from frivolity. It's not even difficult to define the conditions under which that might happen: bad times and suffering often tend to bring out the best in people and societies.

But then, I've learned over the years not to take "The Autonomist" very seriously.