Replies

>> I am sorry in order to have a cover up you have to have
>> facts, and we are still wondering about the details I
>> think to say things like that, is only your opinion.

I believe the facts are clear that after the MMM that the priesthood quorums of the Stakes around the area of the MMM would cooperate with the federal investigators in telling the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. That’s totally unacceptable for a society that believes in obeying, honoring and sustaining the law. That’s totally unacceptable for a people who believed in upholding the US Constitution.

>> It you study history of the Church you will see a
>> pattern and what happen at MMM is foreign to the
>> pattern.

Oh I have studied LDS church history quite extensively. I’ve read just about anything I can find every written by or on or about anyone who has been in the First Presidency and Quorum of the Twelve. Just read up on what was going on in Utah in the mid 1850s with all the sermons on blood atonement and even the Law of Vengeance. Yes indeed the MMM incident was a one-time tragedy in Mormon history. But the games of coverup continue to this day. For example, they’re still covering up their plagiarisms of the Masons. And they’re pretending to no longer be racist yet they still believe as the most correct book on earth one that says some people got dark skin for being wicked and that some got lighter skin by becoming righteous.

>> So to blame Brigham Young when in the pass he follows
>> the pattern of trusting in the Lord is too accused
>> Brigham Young of not having faith in the Lord.

Brigham Young could’ve required the Brethren in southern Utah to cooperate fully with the federal investigators. He didn’t. The murderers got away with it. Only John D. Lee was ever held accountable.

>> I am convert and was converted by the power of the Holy
>> Spirit so there is nothing technically about it!

If you’re honest you’ll honestly examine what all those good feelings and spiritual experiences really mean. When did the idea get started that these good feelings are absolute proof that the LDS Brethren are right and everyone else is not unless they follow the LDS Brethren? Hmmm it comes from the Brethren. How self-serving this is. And as a result true believing Mormons will not have an open mind when it comes to science or truth. That’s why so many people have a problem with Romney. Personally I think he’d make a good President. But I can see why the mistrust is there.

>> Unless you are one of those who never had a testimony?

Oh yes indeed I had a very strong testimony of Mormonism.

>> Beware of Pride

I’m quite familiar with that talk of President Benson. If I’m wrong on Mormonism then I will repent. Not a day goes by that I don’t wish the Book of Mormon was true.

And that’s the real problem, having enough humility to accept that the Book of Mormon is fictional. The scientific evidence is pretty clear on this. Its no more factual than Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

Correction in typing.

I wrote:

... after the MMM that the priesthood quorums of the Stakes around the area of the MMM would cooperate with the federal investigators ....

It should say:

... after the MMM that NONE of the priesthood quorums of the Stakes around the area of the MMM would cooperate with the federal investigators ....

Sorry about the typo omission.

When did the idea get started that these good feelings are absolute proof that the LDS Brethren are right and everyone else is not unless they follow the LDS Brethren?

It comes from God. My testimony was not given or even known about by “the brethren”. My first testimony from the Lord was clear and concise and could have come from no one else. Once you accept that the church is true, you see things with a totally different perspective than someone who believes the church to be false. Things that you have a hard time with, I take in stride without pausing, be cause, “It’s true isn’t it? Then what else matters.” (that ‘s from the last conference session)

If I’m wrong on Mormonism then I will repent.

Well, then since it is true, you’d better get started! (Do you see the difference that a different perspective makes?)

Not a day goes by that I don’t wish the Book of Mormon was true.

Well, my FRiend, you are in luck, because it is true!

And that’s the real problem, having enough humility to accept that the Book of Mormon is fictional. The scientific evidence is pretty clear on this. Its no more factual than Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

Man! Somebody sold you their perspective but GOOOOOOOD.

You cannot “Prove” the gospel is true, and you cannot prove it false. It’s designed that way. What, got to you? Somebody sold you some scientific mumbo jumbo and you believed it? “Science is the history of saying we were wrong” – Unknown. God told me it was true. I’ll take his word over yours, and any and every “scientist” in the room telling me that they have a test tube and proved the BOM false.

Faith, that’s what it’s all about. If you want to get “Scientific” then believing that some guy who died 2,000 years ago “Resurrected” and is going to let you into heaven is pretty far fetched, and what do you have to prove it? A book of Fables and that’s it. If you are going to go forward in faith from there, why stop there? Follow that same testimony that testifies of Jesus Christ and it will lead you to the Book of Mormon. If not, why be a Christian?

This is why I find one Christian questioning the faith of another (as is happening all over this thread) funny. Basically, it’s the blind men and the elephant all over again.

I am sorry you lost your faith in the BOM and in Modern day prophets, I’m sure if you ask it will be restored to you as has happened before.

Have a really wonderful day and my God lead you to the happiness he has prepared for you.

It is a apparent you never received a witness what more can I say!

Not a day goes by that I don’t wish the Book of Mormon was true.

And that’s the real problem, having enough humility to accept that the Book of Mormon is fictional. The scientific evidence is pretty clear on this. Its no more factual than Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

Evidence and faith are at odds with each other. They can be used to back up each other, but in a conversion unto Christ, they are at odds.

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

The BOM says it another way:

Either 12:

6 And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen; wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no witness until after the trial of your faith.

If the gospel was easy and provable, the Jews would have recognized their Messiah. Instead they mocked Him, spit upon Him, denied His miracles, and put Him to death.

But, He lives and offers us hope, if we come unto him and believe, nothing doubting.

All the best!